Are studded tires ok with AWD?

[jruss1601]

So my girlfriend just bought a ford edge and while she used to put studded winter tread tires on her grand am every winter she no longer has that car and her dad said since the edge has AWD its not good to put studded tires on it. I've never heard this and he just be B/S'n her, but maybe theres some truth to it. So do studded tires matter on an AWD Edge?

[feelin edgy]

I don't think putting studded snow tires on an AWD edge would cause any problems. On the other hand, my wife's AWD edge gets around great in snow with factory all season tires, so I don't think studded tires are needed.

[MOFSTEEL]

Studded tires are ok on AWD cars but I hope you understand that they require LONGER stopping distances on dry and wet pavement.

My recommendation is to get yourself a dedicated set of winter tires ...(ie Blizzaks or Wintersport 3D's) unless you plan on mainly driving on ice.

Winter tire > A/S tire in winter conditions.

Edited January 26, 2010 by MOFSTEEL

[jruss1601]

I don't think putting studded snow tires on an AWD edge would cause any problems. On the other hand, my wife's AWD edge gets around great in snow with factory all season tires, so I don't think studded tires are needed.

 

Yeah she agrees. Says her factory tires are doing just fine. So she'll probably stick with those. And she clarified with me last night, her dad said no studs on crossovers, It has nothing to do with AWD. Sorry. Still though i haven't heard of that. I know trucks don't usually get studs. Is it related?

 

I on the other hand totalled a maxima due to slipping on ice. I'm sticking with my studded winter tires every winter on my SHO.

They make take longer to stop on wet and dry roads but you can't stop at all on ice so i'm taking the safest route possible. Studs give you a chance at least

[MOFSTEEL]

And she clarified with me last night, her dad said no studs on crossovers, It has nothing to do with AWD. Sorry. Still though i haven't heard of that. I know trucks don't usually get studs. Is it related?

 

 

 

Sounds like he doesn't know what he's talking about.

You can put studded tires on ANY car, truck, or crossover.

[wwest]

Yeah she agrees. Says her factory tires are doing just fine. So she'll probably stick with those. And she clarified with me last night, her dad said no studs on crossovers, It has nothing to do with AWD. Sorry. Still though i haven't heard of that. I know trucks don't usually get studs. Is it related?

 

I on the other hand totalled a maxima due to slipping on ice. I'm sticking with my studded winter tires every winter on my SHO.

They make take longer to stop on wet and dry roads but you can't stop at all on ice so i'm taking the safest route possible. Studs give you a chance at least

Us old fuddy-duttys are well aware that studs only on the drive wheels of RWD vehicle do not represent a problem.

 

Whereas since most "crossovers" are of FWD origin then using studs ONLY on the drive wheels represents a very serious risk. That may well be what "dad" was trying to convey. For FWD or F/awd vehicles, traction enhancing devices, chains, studs, wintertime specialty tires, whatever, MUST be used on all four corners.

 

Additionally. Tire studs actually reduce the tire's traction on a dry or wet roadbed, so you might find ABS, TC or VSC activating more often, much more often, in those conditions than would a simple summer only, or even a wintertime treaded tire.

 

It is MMHO that summer only use tires are the best way to go all year around. but then be quick to install tire chains (on the rear first and then the fronts to if needed or if FWD). Wintertime specialty tires work fine, excellently, if the tread can "bite" into the surface layer, mud, loose freshly fallen snow, for instance. Once the snow is packed down or the surface is mostly iced over studs are chains will be the only answer. So, summer tires come out ahead overall, quieter and more comfortably riding, and more CSA contact area on solid surfaces.

Edited January 28, 2010 by wwest

[akirby]

It is MMHO that summer only use tires are the best way to go all year around.

 

And your MHO would be absolutely totally wrong in cold climates. Winter tires were developed for a reason and they work well. When summer tires get cold they're hard as a brick and that is WAY more dangerous.

Edited January 28, 2010 by akirby

[igcitng]

I was under the impression that they are illegal. They outlawed tire chains, these would do the same damage to the roads.

[MOFSTEEL]

I was under the impression that they are illegal. They outlawed tire chains, these would do the same damage to the roads.

 

Only in some states (like Illinois).

In some areas they actually promote use such as Lake Tahoe.

There is even areas in Canada where I believe they are required.

[igcitng]

Only in some states (like Illinois).

In some areas they actually promote use such as Lake Tahoe.

There is even areas in Canada where I believe they are required.

 

 

Here we let the snow plows wreck the roads.

[Waldo]

 

It is MMHO that summer only use tires are the best way to go all year around. but then be quick to install tire chains (on the rear first and then the fronts to if needed or if FWD).

 

I was agreeing with you right up to there. As Allen pointed out, the tread compound of a tire is designed to work in a specific temperature range. Get it outside of that range and the tire will not perform as it's designed.

 

I've actually been to an autocross in December where some guys running on snow tires were running faster times than guys running on racing slicks. And the course was 100% dry and clear, but the temperature was right around freezing.

[akirby]

I was agreeing with you right up to there. As Allen pointed out, the tread compound of a tire is designed to work in a specific temperature range. Get it outside of that range and the tire will not perform as it's designed.

 

I've actually been to an autocross in December where some guys running on snow tires were running faster times than guys running on racing slicks. And the course was 100% dry and clear, but the temperature was right around freezing.

 

Willard also believes that FWD based AWD systems are inherently unsafe and should be outlawed. Apparently the laws of physics are different in his universe.....

[blockisle9]

Im from Connecticut and back in the day always used studded tires, they where great! I bought my first 4X4 Explorer back in 1994 and since then have always bought 4X4 or AWD vehicals. I dont think I could go back to rear wheel or even front wheel drive cars. Any way thats just my opinion.

I did find this site regarding States and chain/stud laws

http://www.tirechainsupply.com/tire-chain-laws.html

Lenny

[wwest]

And your MHO would be absolutely totally wrong in cold climates. Winter tires were developed for a reason and they work well. When summer tires get cold they're hard as a brick and that is WAY more dangerous.

 

Yes, and since you have bought that marketing hype I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale and maybe some land in Florida.

 

I lived in central MT for many years, still oftentimes travel there, sometimes even in the wintertime.

 

Back in those days walnut shells were often embedded in the tire rubber in order to increase traction. Those were maybe good for one season, but did the job extremely well. If, as you say, winter specialty tires are softer, or remain more resilient in the COLD, how is it that have the same tread wear mileage rating as my summer only tires??

 

Have you ever seen a traction test of one vs the other on packed snow or ice...?

 

I thought not.

Edited January 29, 2010 by wwest

[wwest]

I was under the impression that they are illegal. They outlawed tire chains, these would do the same damage to the roads.

 

Here in WA it is illegal to use studded tires except during the designated period, wintertime period. Tire chains are a quite viable temporary solution when traveling in areas where traction devices are required. On some rare occassions around here, WA/OR/ID/MT/WY, tire chains might be required by the man in the square brimmed hat in order to proceed even with 4Wd/4X4 and winter tires w/studs.

[blockisle9]

Yes, and since you have bought that marketing hype I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale and maybe some land in Florida.

 

I lived in central MT for many years, still oftentimes travel there, sometimes even in the wintertime.

 

Back in those days walnut shells were often embedded in the tire rubber in order to increase traction. Those were maybe good for one season, but did the job extremely well. If, as you say, winter specialty tires are softer, or remain more resilient in the COLD, how is it that have the same tread wear mileage rating as my summer only tires??

 

Have you ever seen a traction test of one vs the other on packed snow or ice...?

 

I thought not.

Read this:

http://www.insideline.com/features/tire-test-all-season-vs-snow-vs-summer.html

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tire

[MOFSTEEL]

Yes, and since you have bought that marketing hype I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale and maybe some land in Florida.

 

I lived in central MT for many years, still oftentimes travel there, sometimes even in the wintertime.

 

Back in those days walnut shells were often embedded in the tire rubber in order to increase traction. Those were maybe good for one season, but did the job extremely well. If, as you say, winter specialty tires are softer, or remain more resilient in the COLD, how is it that have the same tread wear mileage rating as my summer only tires??

 

Have you ever seen a traction test of one vs the other on packed snow or ice...?

 

I thought not.

 

 

WAIT WAIT WAIT WAIT!!!

 

Did you just say that summer tires and just as good as winter tires in the snow and ice?

You are a bigger idiot than had originally thought.

Do you EVER have anything positive to say? Better yet, do you ever give CORRECT information?

[akirby]

Read this:

http://www.insideline.com/features/tire-test-all-season-vs-snow-vs-summer.html

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tire

 

Or this. http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=82

 

Or this one: http://www.caranddriver.com/features/06q4/a_tire_for_all_seasons_-tech_stuff

Not surprisingly, the snow tire was the best performer. With it we were able to accelerate to 50 mph in 14.2 seconds and stop in 245 feet. As we expected, the all-season RS-A lagged behind, being 3.4 seconds slower in acceleration and needing an extra 20 feet to stop. Those differences might not seem large enough to justify snow tires. And for sure, if your car has all-season tires on it and you live where it doesn't snow often, you can probably get away with them. But as you'll see, any car with high-performance summer tires is going to need another set of tires for the winter months.

 

Surely you don't think Edmunds or Car and Driver have some hidden marketing agenda.

[Waldo]

If, as you say, winter specialty tires are softer, or remain more resilient in the COLD, how is it that have the same tread wear mileage rating as my summer only tires??

 

 

Because tread wear ratings are meaningless numbers created for marketing hype. Plus winter tires have much deeper tread than summer tires.

[wwest]

Read this:

http://www.insideline.com/features/tire-test-all-season-vs-snow-vs-summer.html

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tire

 

I'm not sure I see any point to the links other than verifying my point. Winter specialty tires come out ahead on snow, UNPACKED snow. Summer use only tires come out ahead otherwise. Since that venue wasn't tested, maybe even on ice and packed snow.

[akirby]

I'm not sure I see any point to the links other than verifying my point. Winter specialty tires come out ahead on snow, UNPACKED snow. Summer use only tires come out ahead otherwise. Since that venue wasn't tested, maybe even on ice and packed snow.

 

I couldn't find a good test of summer vs. winter tires on COLD dry pavement, but it should be obvious that cold summer tires can't provide the same level of traction in near freezing temps as a good winter tire. Some mfrs (Toyo e.g.) even warn that some of their summer tires can crack if used below freezing. All season tires would be a lot closer to winter tires and might be ok in moderate cold, but not summer tires. That's just nuts, even for you.

[MOFSTEEL]

I couldn't find a good test of summer vs. winter tires on COLD dry pavement, but it should be obvious that cold summer tires can't provide the same level of traction in near freezing temps as a good winter tire. Some mfrs (Toyo e.g.) even warn that some of their summer tires can crack if used below freezing. All season tires would be a lot closer to winter tires and might be ok in moderate cold, but not summer tires. That's just nuts, even for you.

 

+1

 

Some provinces in Canada have made winter tires MANDATORY.

Austria has a similar law for vehicles over a certain weight.

 

I guess wwest knows something they don't. :rolleyes:

[wwest]

+1

 

Some provinces in Canada have made winter tires MANDATORY.

Austria has a similar law for vehicles over a certain weight.

 

I guess wwest knows something they don't. :rolleyes:

 

 

If I still lived in MT I'd probably be on the side of winter specialty tires, as I was then. But absent living in the that level of wintertime weather I'll go with summer tires and use tire chains at the reasonably rare times of need.

[Waldo]

If I still lived in MT I'd probably be on the side of winter specialty tires, as I was then. But absent living in the that level of wintertime weather I'll go with summer tires and use tire chains at the reasonably rare times of need.

 

So wwest, by implication you're trying to say that rubber properties are not affected by temperature. Do you really believe that? Have you ever watched a motor race and seen what happens when a car comes out of the pits and tries to go fast on cold tires?

 

As I posted earlier, I've witnessed, with my own eyes, cars with winter tires on dry pavement driving faster around an autocross course than cars on real summer autocross tires in cold temperatures.

[MOFSTEEL]

If I still lived in MT I'd probably be on the side of winter specialty tires, as I was then. But absent living in the that level of wintertime weather I'll go with summer tires and use tire chains at the reasonably rare times of need.

 

 

Chains are illegal here in Illinois.