Heater Core Corrosion Letter

[garyedwardsmith]

Gary, sounds like you were born with silver spoon in your mouth. Big deal you had to drive in the cold for a month. Sh.t happens, people trying to help you best they can. I don't know what world you living in but it's not perfect....Stop complaining, life too short.

 

Sorry I worked for everything I have.

 

Yesterday it was -36below here (without WindChill) and the windows weren't defrosting.

 

So I would like to see how chipper you would be!

 

I expect Quality and when I don't get it - I am pissed.

 

Gary

Edited January 9, 2010 by garyedwardsmith

[flyerjmr33]

Hey Gary----

 

All vehicles breakdown--- sooner or later--- in your case, I think that the dealer should at least have a loaner vehicle of some type or pay for a rental. Check your insurance policy--- you may have rental car allowance that you paid for.

This could be worse--- In this case, being worse would have it happening to me!

[akirby]

They licenses Dealers to do it. From the consumers point of view I couldn't give a shit.

 

You must work for Ford. Right?

 

This is exactly what is the problem with the mentality around these Dealers. I gave them shit about taking a month to get the car fixed so they said what are we suppose to do if Ford can't get the tool to me. So one blames the other. In the mean time - I as a customer had to drive the F'n vehicle for a month in freezing weather without heat.

 

Do you think the consumer says Oh I should feel for the Dealer because he can't fix the crap that Ford builds?

 

Do you think the next time I buy a vehicle I am going to say Oh the Dealer was so nice to me despite the piece of crap Ford built, I am going to buy from the Dealer (not unless he sells Toyota or Honda or Kia ..

 

That view of business is simply retarded!

 

Ford is not allowed BY LAW to control their dealers. They try, they get sued and we're right back to where we are today. I'm just saying don't blame Ford because their dealers are inept because there isn't a damn thing they can do about it right now. And I'm sure Ford is just as frustrated about it as you are.

 

Do us all a favor and go buy a Hyundai.

[flyerjmr33]

>>Do us all a favor and go buy a Hyundai. <<

 

Well, I happen to have one of those also, and the closest dealer to me was the worst dealer I have ever done business with-- They broke more than they fixed-- so, they get bought out by the largest Lexus/Toyota Dealer in the area-- Guess what? They are no better at repairing simple stuff than before, and their labor rate is right at $100/hr-----

[Theakerr]

At the risk of getting flamed I find I have to support the gentleman who is cold. However, in my case I have only minor grumbles about the dealer having been provided with a loaner on all occasions when I have had to take the vehicle in. The dealer confirmed that there is a problem with the heating (I knew that) but could not complete the flush because some additional parts were needed for engines built before a certain date. So 1st there was the special tool and now some additional parts. These parts are on rush, but it seems there is a supply problem so I can expect to be a minimum of a week with only minimal heating. Not good up here in the GWN. Fortunately the weather, for the most part has been relatively mild. Further, I would add that it is not just the personal discomfort but when the temp does drop the defrost is boderline. My problem is more with Ford, This heating problem has been known for at least a year (probably longer) and yet they still do not have all the tools in place to fix it. To add to this situation it turns out that I need a new PTO seal, but again theere is a problem with supply. This problem has been known almost from day 1 but only now is there an "engineering solution" and the parts are "somewhere" in the supply chain. As I said to my dealer, Ford may be very good at looking after complaints (ultimately) but if they end up with a reputation for intermittent quality and/or poor engineering then they are headed for serious problems. Just look at Chrysler. I really like my Edge and I wanted to support a NA Manufacturer who had not gone begging. So a new Ford later this year had been almost a certainty. Now?

[Carla J Aldridge Lewis]

I made an appointment and told the service manager of the problem. He said he'd never heard of such.

 

I took my Edge in this morning and reiterated the problem. I never noticed, but as you described the vent on the right is significantly warmer and the vent on the left is always cool. I relayed the symptoms and my knowledge of heater core corrosion, details from this forum, and that a TSB existed on this issue.

 

Four hours later, I have him on the phone. He told me that there would be a significant cost involved because my car is out of warranty. This time I requested that he check the OASIS system and to please call me back.

 

It is frustrating that I have to be so determined.

 

Hi Carla, welcome to the forum. Call your dealership and ask them if they have received their kit to do the radiator/heater core flush. The kit includes special fittings, clamps, a bucket, etc.

 

Give them your VIN and ask them to run an OASIS coded to heater function and they will pull up the instructions and material required. No sense going in if they don't have the kit yet ----BUT you do want to go in before 105,000 miles, even if they don't have the kit, to document your eligibility.

 

Service advisors are not aware of every service notification or TSB that is in the system. Unless they code the concern into OASIS and identify all the material available from Ford on potential concerns, it is perfectly normal for them not to be aware of specific issues.

 

See my earlier post on how they will diagnose your concern. You won't need the letter from Ford as they can find out what they need to know from OASIS. If you have moved since buying your vehicle, that may explain why Ford (Corporate) did not communicate with you.

[bbf2530]

I made an appointment and told the service manager of the problem. He said he'd never heard of such.

 

I took my Edge in this morning and reiterated the problem. I never noticed, but as you described the vent on the right is significantly warmer and the vent on the left is always cool. I relayed the symptoms and my knowledge of heater core corrosion, details from this forum, and that a TSB existed on this issue.

 

Four hours later, I have him on the phone. He told me that there would be a significant cost involved because my car is out of warranty. This time I requested that he check the OASIS system and to please call me back.

 

It is frustrating that I have to be so determined.

 

Hi Carla. :D According to those who have received the "Heater Core letter", the Warranty on the Heater Core has been extended to 6 years/105,000 miles.

 

So if (unfortunately, always a bunch of if's) your particular Edge is covered by the heater core letter, your issue is caused by the heater core defect covered in the letter, your mileage is not over 105,000 miles, your Edge was not a "Salvage Title" used car buy (don't know offhand when/how you purchased), etc etc., then there would be no out-of-pocket expense for you.

 

You may need to call the Ford Customer Satisfaction line to get Ford involved and receive a copy of the "Heater Core letter" sent ot you, if it applies to your Edge. The numbers are in the Warranty Guide brochure you received when you purchased your Edge.

 

Keep us updated.

 

Good luck. :beerchug:

[Carla J Aldridge Lewis]

Though I would post a follow-up.

 

I ended up having to call Ford customer server and getting the campaign number. Once I gave the number to the local dealership, the said they would take care of it. My son and I went to the dealership to get a toolbag out of my Edge and spoke with the service manager. I asked how long it might take to finish and he told me a couple of days. This was on a Monday. I was leaving on a long road trip on Friday, so I called the guy back on Thursday. They hadn't started. They were waiting on parts. I was aggravated because I had been without a car for a week, but I told him I would pick it up and return when I got back from vacation.

 

A week after I returned I made an appointment and dropped of the car on a Tuesday. I didn't get it back until Friday afternoon just before close.

 

I stopped to fill-up on the way home and my son commented at how loud my radiator cooling fan was. I popped the hood only to find the back of one of the cooling fans was gone and non-operational. Additionally, the plastic decorative cover that goes on top of the engine, the one with Ford and 3.5L stamped on it, was gone. I called back to the dealership to be told that was odd and it had never happened before, but to bring it back in (again) on Monday.

 

Over the weekend I had a two hour trip and was able to observe THAT NOTHING HAD CHANGED. The heat still didn't work right. There is a 10 degree difference between the driver and passenger side and it is still fairly cool.

[blockisle9]

Wow, I can not believe how bad some dealers are!! Ford needs to dump some of these dealers.

If it was me, I would go back get my missing parts back and go to a diferent dealer.

My dealer has been fantastic, even when I had the PTU seal replaced, it only took them 3 hours but the gave me a loaner anyway. They offered it to me I did not ask.

Good luck

 

Though I would post a follow-up.

 

I ended up having to call Ford customer server and getting the campaign number. Once I gave the number to the local dealership, the said they would take care of it. My son and I went to the dealership to get a toolbag out of my Edge and spoke with the service manager. I asked how long it might take to finish and he told me a couple of days. This was on a Monday. I was leaving on a long road trip on Friday, so I called the guy back on Thursday. They hadn't started. They were waiting on parts. I was aggravated because I had been without a car for a week, but I told him I would pick it up and return when I got back from vacation.

 

A week after I returned I made an appointment and dropped of the car on a Tuesday. I didn't get it back until Friday afternoon just before close.

 

I stopped to fill-up on the way home and my son commented at how loud my radiator cooling fan was. I popped the hood only to find the back of one of the cooling fans was gone and non-operational. Additionally, the plastic decorative cover that goes on top of the engine, the one with Ford and 3.5L stamped on it, was gone. I called back to the dealership to be told that was odd and it had never happened before, but to bring it back in (again) on Monday.

 

Over the weekend I had a two hour trip and was able to observe THAT NOTHING HAD CHANGED. The heat still didn't work right. There is a 10 degree difference between the driver and passenger side and it is still fairly cool.

[Carla J Aldridge Lewis]

Wow, I can not believe how bad some dealers are!! Ford needs to dump some of these dealers.

If it was me, I would go back get my missing parts back and go to a diferent dealer.

My dealer has been fantastic, even when I had the PTU seal replaced, it only took them 3 hours but the gave me a loaner anyway. They offered it to me I did not ask.

Good luck

 

It turns out, it was even worse. The service director, service manager, and two techs surrounded me and verbally challenged my accusation that they had left parts off. In frustration I exclaimed, "God damn it! Will you let me talk?"

 

"You will not take my lord's name in vain," said the service director. "Get her out of here!" he directed the service manager. "Lady, don't you ever set foot on this property again. Now get out of here!"

 

One tech smirked and sarcastically said, "Have a nice day."

 

It was the single worse customer service experience in my 38 years of life. My heat still isn't working correctly, I am missing parts that had to be removed to perform the repair, and now I have no recourse other than an attorney. Needless to say, I'm fairly upset by it all and could barely drive back to town.

 

FYI: This horrible experience needs to be indexed on the web and associated with the dealership: Ted Russell Ford on 9925 Parkside Drive, Knoxville, TN 37922. Jim Ogle, Service Director, Jamy Tillman, Service Manager, (865) 692-0067

[blockisle9]

Good luck and keep us posted,

I

[bbf2530]

It turns out, it was even worse. The service director, service manager, and two techs surrounded me and verbally challenged my accusation that they had left parts off. In frustration I exclaimed, "God damn it! Will you let me talk?"

 

"You will not take my lord's name in vain," said the service director. "Get her out of here!" he directed the service manager. "Lady, don't you ever set foot on this property again. Now get out of here!"

 

One tech smirked and sarcastically said, "Have a nice day."

 

It was the single worse customer service experience in my 38 years of life. My heat still isn't working correctly, I am missing parts that had to be removed to perform the repair, and now I have no recourse other than an attorney. Needless to say, I'm fairly upset by it all and could barely drive back to town.

 

FYI: This horrible experience needs to be indexed on the web and associated with the dealership: Ted Russell Ford on 9925 Parkside Drive, Knoxville, TN 37922. Jim Ogle, Service Director, Jamy Tillman, Service Manager, (865) 692-0067

 

Hi Carla. :D Wow, odd behavior to say the least. Before you contact a lawyer (and sustain the associated costs) contact Ford Customer Service. In addition, contact the Dealer Owner and/or the Dealer Principal. The Service Manager may be able to refuse to service your car, but he can certainly not ban you from the showroom or from speaking to his superiors.

 

If you receive no satisfaction there, then take out the Warranty Guide you were given when you purchased your vehicle (you were given a copy of the Warranty Guide along with the Owners Manual, Scheduled Maintenance Guide, Tire Warranty Guide etc.). In that small guide (maybe 40 pages), you will find information concerning the "BBB AutoLine Arbitration Program". Read it and use it if necessary. Normally, since your car is outside the regular Warranty you would possibly not been eligible. But since Ford extended the warranty on the heater core, this makes it a Warranty covered issue and you should still be eligible to use the BBB AutoLine program to resolve your Dealer issues.

 

Keep us updated.

 

Good luck. :beerchug:

Edited February 15, 2010 by bbf2530

[08LTDEDGE]

ok, I have a bit of an inside scoop as to the cause of this recall.

The issue is with the heater cores themselves being contaminated during their manufacturing process.

Some heater cores had an excess amount of flux residue that can lead to clogging of the heater core.

This is what is causing the "loss of heat"

Ford is looking at an alternate supplier that had previously offered a heater core that did not require any flux to be used in its manufacturing process, and thereby is not prone to this type of problem.

This heater core is more reliable due to its fluxless manufacturing process but will cost about $5 more per vehicle.

[Theakerr]

Quote "The issue is with the heater cores themselves being contaminated during their manufacturing process.

Some heater cores had an excess amount of flux residue that can lead to clogging of the heater core.

This is what is causing the "loss of heat"

 

Interesting in that it suggests that all heater cores right up to 2010 and possibly later have to be considered suspect. Thats a lot of vehicles. Strange that Ford (and Lincoln) has waited so long to do anything serious about it. If the story is true it does not say a lot about the quest for continuous improvement. and customer satisfaction. Overall my Edge has been in the shop at least 6 times for the heater problem and whilst I have been well treated by the dealer it has used a lot of my time. Fortunately I am retired.

Edited February 24, 2010 by Theakerr

[akirby]

Quote "The issue is with the heater cores themselves being contaminated during their manufacturing process.

Some heater cores had an excess amount of flux residue that can lead to clogging of the heater core.

This is what is causing the "loss of heat"

 

Interesting in that it suggests that all heater cores right up to 2010 and possibly later have to be considered suspect. Thats a lot of vehicles. Strange that Ford (and Lincoln) has waited so long to do anything serious about it. If the story is true it does not say a lot about the quest for continuous improvement. and customer satisfaction. Overall my Edge has been in the shop at least 6 times for the heater problem and whilst I have been well treated by the dealer it has used a lot of my time. Fortunately I am retired.

 

That is NOT what it says. It says "some" meaning there was probably a bad batch of cores with the problem - not ALL of them. It was most likely a change to the production process or human error that occurred recently.

[08LTDEDGE]

That is NOT what it says. It says "some" meaning there was probably a bad batch of cores with the problem - not ALL of them. It was most likely a change to the production process or human error that occurred recently.

 

 

Exactly. Not "ALL" it is "Some"

 

Obviously a process issue where some heater cores either had too much flux applied or did not get it all thoroughly cleaned away or a combination of both.

Ford probably has an ide as to build dates of the heater cores themselves, but with process variations it is difficult to pinpoint after the fact unless they have evidence of a process change which may have contributed to the problem, or knowledge of a process monitoring system that failed.

Once that heater core was approved by Ford the manufacturer would have to notify and get sign off for even minor process changes.

Edited February 25, 2010 by 08LTDEDGE

[Theakerr]

Quote - Exactly. Not "ALL" it is "Some". Normally i dont bother to reply to this sort of thing but I will make an exception in this case. I fully agree the wording is some. However, the word "some" and the cause of the " some" does not appear to batch identifiable or quantifiable. Further, since it is my understanding that the problem appears to be intermittently ongoing does mean that all have to be CONSIDERED suspect. That does not mean they are. Until Ford can identify by VIN number each vehicle that has or may have a problem, I repeat, all vehicles must be considered suspect.

[akirby]

Quote - Exactly. Not "ALL" it is "Some". Normally i dont bother to reply to this sort of thing but I will make an exception in this case. I fully agree the wording is some. However, the word "some" and the cause of the " some" does not appear to batch identifiable or quantifiable. Further, since it is my understanding that the problem appears to be intermittently ongoing does mean that all have to be CONSIDERED suspect. That does not mean they are. Until Ford can identify by VIN number each vehicle that has or may have a problem, I repeat, all vehicles must be considered suspect.

 

Ok, I misred the "considered suspect" comment. Anything covered by the ext. warranty is, by definition, suspect. Although I think we would have heard a lot more complaints if this was a widespread problem.

[igcitng]

Not odd behavior, disturbing behavior. Even if someone were to go ape on them the service manager should be able to hold it together a little better and listen to the customer's concerns about what they feel is wrong, whether there is something wrong or not.

[Carla J Aldridge Lewis]

Hi Carla. :D Wow, odd behavior to say the least. Before you contact a lawyer (and sustain the associated costs) contact Ford Customer Service. In addition, contact the Dealer Owner and/or the Dealer Principal. The Service Manager may be able to refuse to service your car, but he can certainly not ban you from the showroom or from speaking to his superiors.

 

If you receive no satisfaction there, then take out the Warranty Guide you were given when you purchased your vehicle (you were given a copy of the Warranty Guide along with the Owners Manual, Scheduled Maintenance Guide, Tire Warranty Guide etc.). In that small guide (maybe 40 pages), you will find information concerning the "BBB AutoLine Arbitration Program". Read it and use it if necessary. Normally, since your car is outside the regular Warranty you would possibly not been eligible. But since Ford extended the warranty on the heater core, this makes it a Warranty covered issue and you should still be eligible to use the BBB AutoLine program to resolve your Dealer issues.

 

Keep us updated.

 

Good luck. :beerchug:

 

I did contact Ford Motor Corp, and they were very accommodating and understanding. When I expressed hesitation in returning to the same dealer for repair, they suggested I take the vehicle to another dealer. This made me feel a lot better. You cannot imagine what it is like to have four grown men surrounding you and letting you know how ignorant you are.

 

However, to my chagrin, the next dealer said they had an issue with completing someone else's work. Further, because the heat differential between the driver and passenger side is now gone, regardless that the heat only comes out at 92 degrees, it no longer falls under the symptoms of the corrosion issue and therefore is not under warranty.

 

Back to square one.

[igcitng]

I did contact Ford Motor Corp, and they were very accommodating and understanding. When I expressed hesitation in returning to the same dealer for repair, they suggested I take the vehicle to another dealer. This made me feel a lot better. You cannot imagine what it is like to have four grown men surrounding you and letting you know how ignorant you are.

 

However, to my chagrin, the next dealer said they had an issue with completing someone else's work. Further, because the heat differential between the driver and passenger side is now gone, regardless that the heat only comes out at 92 degrees, it no longer falls under the symptoms of the corrosion issue and therefore is not under warranty.

 

Back to square one.

 

That is rediculous. Call Ford back. And find a dealer that is not chummy with the original dealer.

[Packchr21]

Just ran into this corrosion issue. Ford has flushed the system, at ther cost, but still no heat. My service rep wants to replace the heater core now but Ford is telling them the heater core is not covered. I am the second owner of this vehicle, 2008 Edge, so I did not receive a letter on the extended warranty. Can someone tell me the specifics on what is covered on this extended warranty or maybe even provide a copy? Would be much appreciated

[thirdgenlxi]

Wow.... reading some of the previous posts in this thread, there's definitely some very ill informed people in here...eek!

 

Anyways, just to get a few facts straight...... the problem was not the heater cores, or the coolant used, it was CONTAMINATION of the coolant due to the water pump inlet tube. The original water pump inlet tubes were painted with a coating on the inside of the tube, and over time with heat cycles and constant water flowing through it, the paint began to flake off and circulate through the cooling system. And since the heater core has the smallest orifices in the cooling system, that was the first thing to clog. The flushing machine used to flush the system is a BEAST (we have a whole pumping kit just for this procedure).... seriously it'll empty a full 5 gallon bucket of water in a matter of seconds... it will MOVE some water! LOL. So needless to say it'll un-clog just about any heater core. The heater core is covered should it still need to be replaced, but prior approval is needed from Ford before doing so. I've never seen one that actually needed the heater core replaced. The revised green coolant (from the original gold) has nothing to do with the original problem, they just consider it a better coolant (that wasn't available at the time) and are switching everything over to it.... kinda the same reason all the trans fluid is going from Mercon V and Mercon SP over to Mercon LV..... same thing.... standardizing more or less. After the flush procedure was completed, the water pump inlet tube was replaced with a revised tube that was not painted and would not have this issue again

 

If this procedure has been done and you're still having heat problems, then there's a good chance that it either (a) wasn't done correctly (the flush procedure is 26 pages long, and has a LOT of steps, and you have to do certain things at certain temps for it all to work right), or ( it's simply not the reason for your lack of heat problem. There's other things that can cause it as well.... thermostat stuck open, weak water pump, temp blend door actuator (most likely) will all cause low or no heat. Temp blend door actuator isn't an uncommon thing at all.... I've gotta put one in an F-150 next week for the exact same prob (no heat on the left side... actuator is stuck on cold). Sounds like it needs a more thorough diagnosis to figure out what is going on

 

Here's the PDF's with the recall info

 

R09M04.pdf

 

R09M043.pdf

 

R09M044.pdf

Edited February 20, 2013 by thirdgenlxi

[Packchr21]

They've actually done the flush twice and it still doesn't blow hot. They then jacked the front end up and for some reason it started blowing hot air, when they lowered it back down it would stop. They thought there was an air bubble of some kind in the heater core but still have not been able to locate the problem. So they are looking at replacing the heating core. I'm not a mechanic and they are supposed to be the pros so expect them to know the solution.

[thirdgenlxi]

They've actually done the flush twice and it still doesn't blow hot. They then jacked the front end up and for some reason it started blowing hot air, when they lowered it back down it would stop. They thought there was an air bubble of some kind in the heater core but still have not been able to locate the problem. So they are looking at replacing the heating core. I'm not a mechanic and they are supposed to be the pros so expect them to know the solution.

 

Sounds like they need to learn how to bleed the air out of it then.... if it started blowing hot when moved around then there's your problem right there. There's a procedure for bleeding the air out in the procedure, as well as possible causes for air intrusion into the system. An air lift will get the air out no probs. Sounds like you're dealing with some incompetent techs.... I seriously doubt replacing the heater core will fix your problem