MOON ROOF CONTROL LIGHTING

[sanche]

Hello everybody,

 

I remember reading a post about the BAMR control panel having built-in lighting, but on the ford edge, they are strangly not hooked up, The lincoln version is.

 

Can you let a fellow '08 AWD Limited owner know if its worthwhile wiring them up and how to do it?

Its easy to get distracted looking for the right buttons at night.

 

Other then that, love my car, and getting 22 MPG combined (5500 miles on it).

 

Thanks Much, great forum !

 

Sanche

[Lex Talionis]

IIRC, it was never stated they were 'not hooked up'. in fact, I do not even recall seeing that. what I do recall is that some people are bummed it is not there - I have come, over time, to wish they were lit myself actually, but the last I read here some were considering trying to get the Lincoln part and install it into an Edge. never saw anyone actually do it.

 

Now, if this is wrong, let me know as I would gladly wire them up and pass on the exact details on just how to do it. but I suspect the ability is not even there as I would be hard pressed to believe they would put them in, and not wire them up

[sanche]

IIRC, it was never stated they were 'not hooked up'. in fact, I do not even recall seeing that. what I do recall is that some people are bummed it is not there - I have come, over time, to wish they were lit myself actually, but the last I read here some were considering trying to get the Lincoln part and install it into an Edge. never saw anyone actually do it.

 

Attached is a pix of the switch un-assembled. I took this from another forum. The forum member claimed its from an '07 edge and all the hardware is there, just need to apply 12v and lights go on. I think the lincoln version is the same, but for some reason they omit (1) wire to power it on the edge.

 

I will look for the post were this pix came from on the other forum. It had all the details, but I never followed up.

 

Sanche

[Lex Talionis]

sanche.. PLEASE follow up on this here. I was correct it was never done here, but apparently you have another forum that has this info. this is great news. if you can get me the details: where the wire is placed, is it soldered or just crimped on to an open lead somewhere (I cannot tell), do you have to run a wire from your own power supply or is there a power wire there in a bundle nearby just not attached, where are the bulbs to supply light IF you get this hooked up?

 

if you can get me more details, I will do this ASAP and give a write up about it. I am really actually surprised they would not hook this up and hold it back like it is some sort of 'upgrade' just for the Lincoln,

[Lex Talionis]

okay... I started some deep Goggle and found where this post came from. see it here at Bue Oval - it answers a few of my above questions. seems, as per that thread at least, he has not pulled it off (page 3, post #42)... yet

 

also turns out, it was by Jpark, also a member here at our forums! I have a PM in to him to see if we can revive this topic and between us, get this done. if it is all there, and all we need to do is run a wire, I will do this today. BUT, in his last post on the topic, he mentions a $55 14-pin connector pigtail assembly WPT-287 needed to do this, but I 'might' be able to fashion one and work around that - since it seems you only need 2 pins - if I can get a better idea where to attach and what it does, etc.

[sanche]

also turns out, it was by Jpark, also a member here at our forums! I have a PM in to him to see if we can revive this topic and between us, get this done. if it is all there, and all we need to do is run a wire, I will do this today. BUT, in his last post on the topic, he mentions a $55 14-pin connector pigtail assembly WPT-287 needed to do this, but I 'might' be able to fashion one and work around that - since it seems you only need 2 pins - if I can get a better idea where to attach and what it does, etc.

 

Yep, thats it. It may be possible that the manufacturer's name and part-number is on the connector (molex,Panduit,Amp ...). If we can identify the connector, the mating side can be identified. Then its possible to get samples to try this. Otherwse, will have to trace the appropriate circuit(s) and apply dedicated voltage as the poster recommends.

 

Lex, great detective work, if you can identify this connector, let me know and I can find the mating side and send to you, but I think there must be an isolated circuit on the pc board that can be tapped into.

 

Oh-boy whata find :happy feet:

 

Sanche

[sanche]

but I think there must be an isolated circuit on the pc board that can be tapped into.

 

Oh-boy whata find :happy feet:

 

Sanche

 

Lex, After reading Jparks post more carefully, It tells you pins #1 and #2 will light the LED's.

Curious to find out why poster did not follow thru.

 

Sanche

[CopperCarolinaEdge]

I love the fact there are guys like you two on here! Makes it great for non-tech guys like me!! I await anxiously for further updates as I would LOVE to have those lit up!

 

Thanks for all you do!!

[Lex Talionis]

I am now on a mission to do this. I already took the unit apart to scope it out. I have tackled projects WAY bigger than this here on my Edge and made them happen... this should be totally doable. I just need a little more understanding.

 

Sanche, I also read the part about "(pins 1 and 2 on the switch connector)" BUT I am not sure what or where that references on that board? Do you? Can you tell by looking at the image?

 

And, IF you did know what/where those were on the board, does that mean one is power and 1 is ground and if we ground 1 and run power to other, we can fire it up?

 

Now, If so, why the mention of that $55 pigtail? Does that, I wonder, imply that you can take the purchased pigtail, plug that into the bundle coming out of the headliner and plug that new pigtail into the unit and have it fire up quicker than running a new wire? The pigtail comment implies to me that that pig tail you could buy would bypass the current connection and supply the needed power to that motherboard to light those LEDs. In a way, that makes sense as that seems like something they could just pop in at the factory to make this system work rather than running wires as many of these parts are the same as in the Lincoln.

 

Anyway... if we can hear from Jpark, it might explain more as I am a little confused by what the pig tail would offer or if, since we only tie into 2 pins, we can manually do this (clip or solder to a pin) and get this going.

[CopperCarolinaEdge]

Now, If so, why the mention of that $55 pigtail? Does that, I wonder, imply that you can take the purchased pigtail, plug that into the bundle coming out of the headliner and plug that new pigtail into the unit and have it fire up quicker than running a new wire? The pigtail comment implies to me that that pig tail you could buy would bypass the current connection and supply the needed power to that motherboard to light those LEDs. In a way, that makes sense as that seems like something they could just pop in at the factory to make this system work rather than running wires as many of these parts are the same as in the Lincoln.

 

Anyway... if we can hear from Jpark, it might explain more as I am a little confused by what the pig tail would offer or if, since we only tie into 2 pins, we can manually do this (clip or solder to a pin) and get this going.

 

Holy Crap! I've read this post 4 TIMES and still don't have a clue what you said! :wacko:

[Lex Talionis]

I want to better get a grip on what this

 

"The only reason they're not lighted is that there's no wire running from the Accessory Delay feed running up the A-pillar to the switch assembly...a 3-foot piece of wire, and missing only on the Edge. The ground is already there."

 

and this

 

"That's a little steep for the two pins I'm going to remove from it and plug into the connector already in the car (so I can run the ground and Accessory Delay leads),"

 

amount to? as these together make it sound so simple. If I could only understand

 

1) is the ground already done and in place, no need to worry about that since the board is already powered given it controls the map lights already, or is one of the pins for the ground and we still need to ground it, he is just saying it is there for us ready to use

2) where are the 2 pins and what pin is what?

3) why the mention of the pigtail if it simply is just 3 feet of wire we need?

4) what color wire is the "accessory delay feed"

Edited August 21, 2008 by Lex Talionis

[Lex Talionis]

Holy Crap! I've read this post 4 TIMES and still don't have a clue what you said! :wacko:

 

no worries... if I can nail it down, I will do a better idea of explaining what is what and how it is done. with photos. for now, just talking out loud hoping someone who similarly understands this stuff can clarify some of the unknowns. once that is done, we will be cooking with fire.

[MKX2007]

Perhaps, without the pigtail you won't be able to turn the lights on or off independently? There appears to be 2 pins at the top of the board. There probably is a 2 pin connector on the pigtail. For the end result, I would think $55.00 is a bargain.

[Lex Talionis]

There appears to be 2 pins at the top of the board. There probably is a 2 pin connector on the pigtail.

 

I believe what you see as 'pins' are, in fact, actually slices in the plastic housing that are for the clips on the opposite piece to snap home. I have attached a blown up pixelated image of that board, you can see only circuits at the top of that board. no 'pins' that I see. The image below that I found also and it seems to show the motherboard taken out of the plastic housing - maybe giving access to actual pins on the other side?

 

For the end result, I would think $55.00 is a bargain.

 

I would tend to agree if it is that simple and allows to plug-n-play activation by hooking into the existing harness that is in the head liner and not have to run a wire. I would buy it as it would be clean and take advantage of prewired ground and power. IF that is what it does (see the pig tail image I found below). I might actually go by the dealer and have them pull up this section of Edge parts on their computer and then pull the same parts up for the Lincoln and see if it shows an additional pigtail or inline adaptor versus the Edge model parts - or at least, show this section of parts and what a discernible difference is.

 

 

 

Edited August 21, 2008 by Lex Talionis

[sanche]

I believe what you see as 'pins' are, in fact, actually slices in the plastic housing that are for the clips on the opposite piece to snap home. I have attached a blown up pixelated image of that board, you can see only circuits at the top of that board. no 'pins' that I see. The image below that I found also and it seems to show the motherboard taken out of the plastic housing - maybe giving access to actual pins on the other side?

 

 

 

I would tend to agree if it is that simple and allows to plug-n-play activation by hooking into the existing harness that is in the head liner and not have to run a wire. I would buy it as it would be clean and take advantage of prewired ground and power. IF that is what it does (see the pig tail image I found below). I might actually go by the dealer and have them pull up this section of Edge parts on their computer and then pull the same parts up for the Lincoln and see if it shows an additional pigtail or inline adaptor versus the Edge model parts - or at least, show this section of parts and what a discernible difference is.

 

 

 

 

Lex,

 

Thanks for posting the pics, I have not had a chance to take my switch apart yet. I can see that there are solder pins #'d 1 - 7 and 8 - 14. I could be wrong, but I think Jpark is refering to pins 1 and 2 in the first row.

 

Can you please post a picture of the mating connector (or harness) coming from the roof to the switch.

I want to see if there are contacts on the harness side for pins 1 and 2. If not, you need a test light to find out which is the hot socket (ign. sw.on) and mark it.

 

Using an ohmeter (ground yourself first), see if its possible to get continuity from pin-1 or 2 TO one side of each LED.

If so, reconnect pc board( w/o switch cover) to the harness connector and apply 12v to pin 1 and or pin 2 from the source you marked on the roof harness side, if they light, we're golden.

 

Why is there a piece of tape over the LED on one of your pics?

 

Thanks, Sanche

[Lex Talionis]

So, it dawned on me last night what this whole "pin" reference was and I am one step closer to solving this. :shades:

 

On the flip side of the mother board are 2 pinned harnesses ports that the 2 pigtails from the headliner plug into. Notice the 2 pigtails are white and gray. Notice the gray port on the motherboard has 14 "pins" while the white port has 3 larger pins. The gray one seems to power the BAMR roof controls while the white one seems to supply power to the overhead map lights. I believe these are the 'pins' Jpark reference, they were never seen in his photo as they are on the opposite side.

 

Now, look at just the gray pigtail - the key one in solving this I believe - coming from the headliner - as the pictures show, there are 18 lead/pin holes available in total, not 14. BUT also notice that we only use 6 of them (as seen by looking at the wires in the bundle that come into the backside of the gray pigtail). So, when you plug this pigtail in, it is contacting just 6 of the 14 open pins on the motherboard side. So, this tells me that in the Lincoln, there is/are another wire(s) coming into that gray pigtail in that wire bundle and in the end, making more than 6 pin connections. This lines up with Jparks reference to just needing another '3 feet of wire' as the ground is there already for us.

 

SO.. the million dollar questions are (1) what lead/pin hole would you run a wire into (notice there are 8 to select from that would line up with pins), which one is the golden pin and (2) what color existing wire would you tap into the existing wire bundle to get the correct power if you knew what lead/pin hole to tap into. Jpark mentions "accessory delay feed" - if so, what color is that currently?

 

[Lex Talionis]

Lex,

 

Thanks for posting the pics, I have not had a chance to take my switch apart yet. I can see that there are solder pins #'d 1 - 7 and 8 - 14. I could be wrong, but I think Jpark is refering to pins 1 and 2 in the first row.

 

Can you please post a picture of the mating connector (or harness) coming from the roof to the switch.

I want to see if there are contacts on the harness side for pins 1 and 2. If not, you need a test light to find out which is the hot socket (ign. sw.on) and mark it.

 

Using an ohmeter (ground yourself first), see if its possible to get continuity from pin-1 or 2 TO one side of each LED.

If so, reconnect pc board( w/o switch cover) to the harness connector and apply 12v to pin 1 and or pin 2 from the source you marked on the roof harness side, if they light, we're golden.

 

Why is there a piece of tape over the LED on one of your pics?

 

Thanks, Sanche

 

okay.. given my new info above, we posted at same time.. what do you think now?

 

In looking at the motherboard we currently have wires coming into pins 5,6,8,10,11,14

 

If so, now what process might we follow to determine which pin(s) will make this happen? Jpark references pins #1 and 2. It seems to me you should be able to run a power wire up to the gray pigtail and into open lead/holes #1 and #2, touch the pin, and see if it fires up those lights.. no? ground is in place, so it seems just adding power to those pins 1 at a time until it lights up would tell us what pin and not harm this motherboard. once you figure that, you could then tie it into the correct "accessory delay feed" power wire (which still needs to be determined yet). would we agree on this or is there a better method?

 

what would solve all of this so easy would be if someone reading this with a Lincoln - like MKX2007 :) would pop down this control panel - very easy, just pull down the edge closest to your head - and snap a photo like my last one above that shows what color wires come into what port on the back of that pigtail. then we could clearly see what wire we are missing AND what color it is AND what lead/port it goes into on that pigtail...

 

(that tape on the led is not my photo, it is one I found and posted for reference)

Edited August 21, 2008 by Lex Talionis

[sanche]

So, it dawned on me last night what this whole "pin" reference was and I am one step closer to solving this. :shades:

 

SO.. the million dollar questions are (1) what lead/pin hole would you run a wire into (notice there are 8 to select from that would line up with pins), which one is the golden pin and (2) what color existing wire would you tap into the existing wire bundle to get the correct power if you knew what lead/pin hole to tap into.

 

Thanks for the pictures, its the next best thing to being there.

 

I'm studying them and looking at the patterns (pin locations) of the m/b receptical/WPT-287 conn./production connector relative to the alignment key on all three.

 

I think the answer to # 2 question requires a test light (probe) or better yet a voltmeter. Ground one side of the meter(test light) and check each connector socket for voltage, with the ignition key on of course

I think you should see battery voltage, but to be sure, I would use a voltmeter. If it's other that 12v, problem may be a little more difficult to solve. You can then try finding which is live in accessory position as well, then you will have a voltage source to tap into and may also be the accessory lead your looking for.

 

For the #1 question, my guess at this point is the second pin from the left, top row in the picture showing the gray socket attached to the mother board. But before you try to light them up, PLEASE see if you can get continuity between the solder pin marked #2 and the LED's. If you do, the next thing to check is solder pin #2 to the pin I described in gray receptical.

 

Can you post a couple more pics that show the M/B solder pin #s and gray socket, like Jpark's pic, but one that shows the side w/ the gray receptical.

 

I'll check in later, thanks much,

 

Sanche

[Lex Talionis]

NEW INFO

 

I have confirmed (by using a test light and grounding it to frame and touching it to all used leads with key turned to on) the following leads functions:

 

5 - close sun shade

6 - open sun shade

8 - close BAMR

10 - open vent feature BAMR

11 - open BAMR

14 - no action, so I assume it is the ground (black wire)

 

with key into on position, and grounding the test light on frame of car, none of these light the test light to show power, they just close the circuit and made the above functions trigger. I am thinking the power is actually coming in via the white pigtail plug as the overhead map lights stay on even when I remove the gray pigtail - showing power source. so the gray pigtail is providing control to the motherboard, but it seems the white pigtail is giving power to it. when I ground the test light and touch these 3 metal leads behind the overhead map lights, the test light powers up on all 3 leads (1 handles power always when key in, 1 powers up only when door open triggers it, one provides power only when push map light button).

 

Now this being said, I will see about posting a better pict of what Jpark had of motherboard BUT to do that you really have to break that whole unit down... it is numerous pieces stacked together.... which is kind of a PITA I can tell. So, I want to try to solve it prior to getting to that level.

 

I have a voltmeter, but honestly I need some help setting it up to conduct tests as that has always been a mystical unit to me. For example, the red lead and black leads plug into what ports on the meter? then, what do I set the meter selector to? then, once I get it setup, how do I test continuity between solder pin and LEDs? touch it (black ground) to the solder area and touch the metal area of the LED with red power lead? and then, what readout am I looking for? again, this would all require breakdown of that whole unit and I would love to solve this by using my test light data above if possible as I think it we have access to all we need here without taking that unit apart down to the motherboard.

Edited August 21, 2008 by Lex Talionis

[sanche]

NEW INFO

 

I have confirmed (by using a test light and grounding it to frame and touching it to all used leads with key turned to on) the following leads functions:

 

5 - close sun shade

6 - open sun shade

8 - close BAMR

10 - open vent feature BAMR

11 - open BAMR

14 - no action, so I assume it is the ground (black wire)

 

with key into on position, and grounding the test light on frame of car, none of these light the test light to show power, they just close the circuit and made the above functions trigger. I am thinking the power is actually coming in via the white pigtail plug as the overhead map lights stay on even when I remove the gray pigtail - showing power source. so the gray pigtail is providing control to the motherboard, but it seems the white pigtail is giving power to it. when I ground the test light and touch these 3 metal leads behind the overhead map lights, the test light powers up on all 3 leads (1 handles power always when key in, 1 powers up only when door open triggers it, one provides power only when push map light button).

 

Now this being said, I will see about posting a better pict of what Jpark had of motherboard BUT to do that you really have to break that whole unit down... it is numerous pieces stacked together.... which is kind of a PITA I can tell. So, I want to try to solve it prior to getting to that level.

 

I have a voltmeter, but honestly I need some help setting it up to conduct tests as that has always been a mystical unit to me. For example, the red lead and black leads plug into what ports on the meter? then, what do I set the meter selector to? then, once I get it setup, how do I test continuity between solder pin and LEDs? touch it (black ground) to the solder area and touch the metal area of the LED with red power lead? and then, what readout am I looking for? again, this would all require breakdown of that whole unit and I would love to solve this by using my test light data above if possible as I think it we have access to all we need here without taking that unit apart down to the motherboard.

 

No problem, don't take everything apart if you're uncomfortable. As far as the meter, the red lead is positive and black is standard negitive (-), usually the red lead plugs into different ranges for amps,resistance,volts (ac or dc). my meter has a rotary switch to set all the ranges.

To check continuity is simple, set to ohms (resistance) scale 0-100 ohms for example(the value at this scale does not matter, you just want to know if the needle swings or readout is at or close to zero). If it does not swing its an open circuit.

So if you touch solder pin #2 w/ one lead and the second top pin, top row on the gray receptical w/the other, if no swing, then the 2 pins are not electrically connected.

 

Sanche

[Lex Talionis]

No problem, don't take everything apart if you're uncomfortable. As far as the meter, the red lead is positive and black is standard negitive (-), usually the red lead plugs into different ranges for amps,resistance,volts (ac or dc). my meter has a rotary switch to set all the ranges.

To check continuity is simple, set to ohms (resistance) scale 0-100 ohms for example(the value at this scale does not matter, you just want to know if the needle swings or readout is at or close to zero). If it does not swing its an open circuit.

So if you touch solder pin #2 w/ one lead and the second top pin, top row on the gray receptical w/the other, if no swing, then the 2 pins are not electrically connected.

 

Sanche

 

yep, I at least knew the - and + color correspondance , just not so much how to read and set it up.

 

either way, I would think, with all I have tracked down and photoed above, we should be able to solve this without going that route and taking that unit apart to get readings, no? with those photos, and the detail on the pins I just provided, it seems we should be able to determine what pin will activate those darn LEDs?

 

at this stage, it seems I should be able have the gray pigtail plug plugged into the motherboard harness (so the board has ground applied to the pins), slide through the open lead holes a power wire to one of the open pins and touch the pin and see the LED lights light up through the buttons face like on the steering wheel... no? it seems all about just providing power to one - I assume just 1 - of the pins to determine which pin is the one to trigger the lights? I will worry about tracking the correct power source to the pin later, but figuring the pin first is key. Not sure why Jpark said pin #1 AND #2 as I would think 1 pin would power all 4 LED lights at 1 time? I am also assuming the #1 and #2 referenced 'pins' are in fact one of those not used on the motherboard side that the gray pigtail mates to.

 

note: I blew a fuse, I think #25 10 amp, trying to apply power - jumped from a local power source in the same area - to the open pins. so not sure if to much power, or the ground to the pins via #14 is not the only ground we need and we need another along with power... I assumed the ground, black #14 was grounding the full unit, it seems not though with the blown fuse result.

Edited August 25, 2008 by Lex Talionis

[sanche]

yep, I at least knew the - and + color correspondance , just not so much how to read and set it up.

 

either way, I would think, with all I have tracked down and photoed above, we should be able to solve this without going that route and taking that unit apart to get readings, no? with those photos, and the detail on the pins I just provided, it seems we should be able to determine what pin will activate those darn LEDs?

 

Hi Lex,

 

OK, The last thought I have is to try GROUNDING the pins we think are golden. Perhaps when the M/B is plugged in. the voltage is there, just needs ground. If that does not work, I'll have to work with this myself on my Edge.

I don't want to make any further suggestions to cause you to blow the board.

I guess as a last resort, I can check w/ the dealer and order the $55 harness, but damn,we're soooo close

Lots of good solid investigation on your part so far, it's much apprieciated by all I'm sure, Thanks so much.

I'll see what I can do. - Sanche

[Lex Talionis]

yeah, other heads involved would be good. my head is starting to spin with the fast and furious work I have been doing on this to try to solve it. I love a good challenge and the thrill of the hunt, but I feel like I am missing something obvious here.

 

when I touched the grounded test light to the pigtail lead holes from the roof liner, that is when the different events triggered (open, close, shade, etc) and allowed me to narrow down what pigtail lead, and thus what pin on the MB, did what. MB was on the floor at that time.

 

Is your logic then that maybe the golden pin(s) would need ground to possible activate the LED lights based on what I found?

 

If so, you would have to hook the pigtail into the MB and then on the open lead holes, slide in a wire or something (since it is such a small opening) to make connect through the open hole with the pin and see if ground also activated the LEDs. but if that were true, why would Jpark mention a wire needing to go to a delayed power source? remember, it seem pin and pigtail 14 supply ground to the MB when plugged in.

 

I would say it is time you get involved with your Edge also.. I agree we are close.

[RayoVac]

Hey guys,

 

I have just been skimming this thread and maybe you have already thought of this but...

 

If the Moon Roof controls have illumination via LED or some other light type bulb, why not just check continuity on the Anode side of the LED or positive side of the bulb against all the pins you have to work with. Even if LED dropping voltage though a resistor circuit you should still see resistance vs. open circuit.

 

Maybe you have already tried this. Also note... my edge does not have the BAMR but my wife's does (yes we have two). If the BAMR controls come down easily I would be happy to remove them to figure out what pins ultimately would feed voltage to the illumination.

 

Rayo

[Lex Talionis]

Hey guys,

 

I have just been skimming this thread and maybe you have already thought of this but...

 

If the Moon Roof controls have illumination via LED or some other light type bulb, why not just check continuity on the Anode side of the LED or positive side of the bulb against all the pins you have to work with. Even if LED dropping voltage though a resistor circuit you should still see resistance vs. open circuit.

 

Maybe you have already tried this. Also note... my edge does not have the BAMR but my wife's does (yes we have two). If the BAMR controls come down easily I would be happy to remove them to figure out what pins ultimately would feed voltage to the illumination.

 

Rayo

 

yeah, we kind of discussed this earlier, I am just not adept with a voltage meter.

 

The control unit comes down super, duper easy and consists of the trim/map lights/sunglasses holder. then, when you unplug the white and gray pigtails, you can pull the whole unit out. maybe 5 seconds. if you wish, you can even remove the actual stand alone BAMR controls from the full unit in about 5 more seconds as it is just snap fit into the full unit - you will then have the stand alone controls and map lights as one separate unit and can run you tests as that piece is just snap fit into the trim/sunglass housing. if you wish, you could even go a step further and separate the actual stand alone BAMR controls into a further 2 pieces of top (switches) and bottom (motherboard).

 

so, if you want to get involved, if you could figure out what pins ultimately would feed voltage to the LEDs, that would be great.

 

It seems Jpark did that when he mentioned "pins #1 and #2".. but if someone adept with a voltage meter could confirm that it would be great. Then, once we confirm that, what the next step it? supplying power to both pins?

Edited August 23, 2008 by Lex Talionis