Special_K Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 (edited) Good day! Lets just rip the band-aid off, I am here to once again hash and discuss the pros, cons and ideas of possibly fabricating an intake for the platform, but with a twist....... I HAVE NUMBERS!!! So having an edge that is demanding alot of air (catless, custom turbos, etc) I figured why not test on our specific vehicle as it will exaggerate any results! So here we go: Decided to test a theory, less restriction = more power, but heat will defeat the power gained by less restriction. So to test this I took the top of the air-box off and left the bottom half in to still provide some "Cool" air to the intake area. I put some aluminum screen over the intake as a two dollar proof of concept, to protect the motor from sucking in foreign objects, and connected the intake sensor and mounted it near the intake for an accurate measurement. Now for testing sake we did both logs, on the same stretch of road, in drive, with TC off, from 0-100 and on the same day. Was able to get a log with stock airbox and about 15 min later with the screen. NOTE: During these test a K&N Dropin was used in the stock airbox, and the screen was used for 10miles to just test a theory. Now for observed results: Stock airbox with drop-in filter: Start boost air temp 102 End boost temp 148 Max turbo flow 66.4 lb/min at 23.2 PSI Screen "Filter": Start boost air temp 115 End boost temp 141 Max turbo flow 65.2 lb/min at 19.3 PSI Observations: With the screen filter we did notice a higher starting temp than using the stockbox however when WOT the temp quickly dropped BELOW the stock air box lowest recorded temp by 4 degrees and ended at a lower temp. The biggest note here is the drop in pressure with the same flow! The car did feel slower, this is due to the incoming air being well beyond tuned safety limits, and is noted in the log. We have sent both logs to BCB for review and input and they will be getting back to us soon! I have included images for observation and discussion. As soon as i can figure out a way to post view-able logs i will doing so. AND DISCUSS! - Special thanks to @snmjim for letting me test this theory! Edited June 11, 2019 by Special_K 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snmjim Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 And yet another Perf restriction find...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 11, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 4 minutes ago, snmjim said: And yet another Perf restriction find...? Maybe, we dont have definite confirmation yet ;-). just proof of concept! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWPerfA_ZN0W Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Longterm, not a good idea to leave the screen in place as a lot of c*** will make its way into the engine. Better served by extending the snorkel to the signature light/foglamp area, that WILL enhance performance, not by a lot, but possibly shave a tenth off the 1/4 time. I assume the airbox is sealed from the engine bay, whether to the hood or in OEM fashion. Might want to play with insulating the inside. If you want to improve airflow, you can dimple the inside of the custom intake (like a golf ball) as well as the throttle body/plate. True duals to the turbos are definitely a plus, feeding more air plus some "improvement" in sound. Hard pipes would look nicer, but not necessary since not on the boost side. A dropin K&N/K&N-style filter will likely be all the improvement you need as far as the filter is concerned. Of course it does not add bling to the engine bay 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 11, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 5 minutes ago, WWWPerfA_ZN0W said: Longterm, not a good idea to leave the screen in place as a lot of c*** will make its way into the engine. Better served by extending the snorkel to the signature light/foglamp area, that WILL enhance performance, not by a lot, but possibly shave a tenth off the 1/4 time. I assume the airbox is sealed from the engine bay, whether to the hood or in OEM fashion. Might want to play with insulating the inside. If you want to improve airflow, you can dimple the inside of the custom intake (like a golf ball) as well as the throttle body/plate. True duals to the turbos are definitely a plus, feeding more air plus some "improvement" in sound. Hard pipes would look nicer, but not necessary since not on the boost side. A dropin K&N/K&N-style filter will likely be all the improvement you need as far as the filter is concerned. Of course it does not add bling to the engine bay I did forget to mention that we did the screen for all of 10 miles to test a theory ? What i cant get over is the turbos maintaing close to the same output but with 4 psi less.....means they are trying less and less load on the motor. We tried "porting" the stock airbox with a 2.5" pvc plumbers nightmare down to fender well....... results were so little we never even posted that fail. Im not to worried about the Turbo inlet Pipes (TIP) as much as the airbox as it is only sucking from a 9sq/in hole......thats alot of air to shove through that tiny hole! Ill update the OP with the fact that we are using a drop-in K&N. Thanks for the input!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWPerfA_ZN0W Posted June 12, 2019 Report Share Posted June 12, 2019 The upgraded turbos are definitely worth it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project_Edge Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 So anyone consider altering the Steeda Intake for the Fusion Sport to fit the Edge? It looks like the engine in the edge sits lower than in the fusion so it would have to come up to seal at the hood. But I wonder if Steeda would be interested in developing one? They have great customer service and have helped me in the past with my weird requests... LOL. Just a thought. https://www.steeda.com/steeda-fusion-twin-turbo-cold-air-kit 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 13, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 37 minutes ago, Project_Edge said: So anyone consider altering the Steeda Intake for the Fusion Sport to fit the Edge? It looks like the engine in the edge sits lower than in the fusion so it would have to come up to seal at the hood. But I wonder if Steeda would be interested in developing one? They have great customer service and have helped me in the past with my weird requests... LOL. Just a thought. https://www.steeda.com/steeda-fusion-twin-turbo-cold-air-kit I remember vaugley seeing something about someone fitting one and having to force fit it. will need to take a moment to search the forums and find it. P.S. the fusion forums constantly complains about the fit and finish of the steeda intake. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onyxbfly Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Special_K said: I remember vaugley seeing something about someone fitting one and having to force fit it. will need to take a moment to search the forums and find it. P.S. the fusion forums constantly complains about the fit and finish of the steeda intake. This forum has a variety of people in all walks of life, from engineers to performance enthusiast. The majority of people complained about the Steeda intake. There is some serious testing and data logging illustrated there. If anyone is interested, its a interesting read. https://www.fusionsportforums.com/forum/225-fusion-v6-sport-performance/13970-steeda-cai-received-installed.html 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 13, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 Just heard back from Casey at BCB from the logs comparing the stock airbox vs the screens. I quote: "very interesting with the intake removed. there is quite a big pressure drop across the stock airbox it looks like. turbos not working nearly as hard to compensate" So that is good news, means we are on the right track! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project_Edge Posted June 14, 2019 Report Share Posted June 14, 2019 (edited) Hmm. I didn't know of the problems with the intake. Figured it might be a path to developing on since the engines are similar. I'll lurk more and post less. LOL. I would love to see someone like Gail Banks on a project like this. I am loving watching his videos on the rear diff cover he is developing for the F150 and other trucks. Edited June 14, 2019 by Project_Edge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2019 18 hours ago, Special_K said: Just heard back from Casey at BCB from the logs comparing the stock airbox vs the screens. I quote: "very interesting with the intake removed. there is quite a big pressure drop across the stock airbox it looks like. turbos not working nearly as hard to compensate" So that is good news, means we are on the right track! To expand further he called back yesterday to tell me that at 5000 rpm with stock air box the wastegate was at full duty cycle, with the "intake" we still have about 22% left in the wastegate at the same point. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOR_ST Posted June 14, 2019 Report Share Posted June 14, 2019 Okay new member here, I just heard from aFe Power in Southern California and they have one ready to go, but need to test it. Anyone on the form live in Southern Cali, and have an Edge ST? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snmjim Posted June 14, 2019 Report Share Posted June 14, 2019 4 hours ago, THOR_ST said: Okay new member here, I just heard from aFe Power in Southern California and they have one ready to go, but need to test it. Anyone on the form live in Southern Cali, and have an Edge ST? Please provide contact info so we can inquire & coordinate R&D. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOR_ST Posted June 14, 2019 Report Share Posted June 14, 2019 1 hour ago, snmjim said: Please provide contact info so we can inquire & coordinate R&D. Tyler Carrington Direct Sales advanced FLOW engineering, inc. Company: 951-493-7100 Extension: 7150 Email: tcarrington@afepower.com Web: www.afepower.com 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 15, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2019 Just contacted them and he will be in touch with us tomorrow to go over details. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWPerfA_ZN0W Posted June 15, 2019 Report Share Posted June 15, 2019 On 6/14/2019 at 6:17 AM, Special_K said: To expand further he called back yesterday to tell me that at 5000 rpm with stock air box the wastegate was at full duty cycle, with the "intake" we still have about 22% left in the wastegate at the same point. Does he have graphs to compare where the difference starts manifesting? Is it all through the range, or after 2500 rpm, or ...? Kinda like dyno sheets 22% is a LOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtra Posted June 16, 2019 Report Share Posted June 16, 2019 On 6/14/2019 at 7:58 AM, THOR_ST said: Okay new member here, I just heard from aFe Power in Southern California and they have one ready to go, but need to test it. Anyone on the form live in Southern Cali, and have an Edge ST? I live about 90 min from aFe. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snmjim Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 4 hours ago, Xtra said: I live about 90 min from aFe. Xtra, If you don't mind, can you hold on a little bit, we're already in discussions with the aFe POC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
037 Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 I'm surprised the engine cover is still on. I raced without it and felt car liked it that way better. Saves weight if nothing else. Once you guys have a 2.7 intake my 3.0 could use a little sound beyond battery operated high speed screw driver. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
037 Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 I think more apples to apples was to use your setup but keep the box and close it, screen instead of filter to measure filter restriction without heating things up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special_K Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 6 hours ago, 037 said: I think more apples to apples was to use your setup but keep the box and close it, screen instead of filter to measure filter restriction without heating things up. If you refer to OP it actually didnt heat things up that drastically. And what we were testing was the OEM box restriction, not the filter element. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtra Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 17 hours ago, snmjim said: Xtra, If you don't mind, can you hold on a little bit, we're already in discussions with the aFe POC. No problem , I am too messed up to deal with it anyway. Heck, I can't even get the prototype off my car and ship it to you or Special_K yet. This has been a huge setback for me. I have a gut feeling what the aFe intake is anyway.... We will see. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
037 Posted June 18, 2019 Report Share Posted June 18, 2019 7 hours ago, Special_K said: If you refer to OP it actually didnt heat things up that drastically. And what we were testing was the OEM box restriction, not the filter element. Yes, go fast enough and there is enough air under hood to move around and be ingested, but it's the first 60mpg where it will be absolutely disgusting. Stop the car and Temps sky rocket. Not really sure what the test accomplishes with no box at all, there is no design that works like that so why test? Also, not sure how accurate that sensor is just hanging out there. In my head the empty box scenario would provide better data considering how good the box is otherwise. Maybe even heat wrap the box to insulate from engine... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimcrim Posted June 18, 2019 Report Share Posted June 18, 2019 36 minutes ago, 037 said: Maybe even heat wrap the box to insulate from engine... This is a good idea to test 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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