Poor trans shifting theory investigation

[akirby]

Interesting.  A bad batch of solenoids would explain some of the problems at least.

[jamie1073]

2 hours ago, Fingernip said:

Brought my car in this morning and the dealer just called me to say they have reproduced my concern and have a solenoid replacement repair recommended by the ford dealer service forum community. They are ordering the parts now and will release the car to me as we wait for the parts to arrive. They mentioned that it is a wide spread problem that seems to effect a large portion of this model and they have no word if Ford is planning to release a TSB or not. I asked if they can disclose all of there findings and investigation so I can share it here and they agreed. 

 

Keep us posted.  I need to have mine looked at would prefer to have some more info to give them to speed up the process if it is the same issues. 

[TomCinMI]

On 4/1/2019 at 5:31 PM, jamie1073 said:

 

Keep us posted.  I need to have mine looked at would prefer to have some more info to give them to speed up the process if it is the same issues. 

 

Yes, Fingernip, thank you, & please let us know anything additional you learn. Would be very helpful to be directed to the particular "ford dealer service forum community" thread, so our other dealers can go straight to it; would you please ask your service folks where to find the thread?

 

From what another forum contributor here mentioned about a Power-train Control Module (PCM) update that showed up on a diagnostic scan of his/her vehicle, which that owner said has been helpful, there may very well be more than one trans tweak that's required.

[Sage]

If this has been posted already, sorry about that.

 

 

[bobyellow]

6 minutes ago, Sage said:

If this has been posted already, sorry about that.

 

 

Nice! I'd guess that I've already completed this... or not? I had my PCM reprogramed on 2/15/19. Guess I'll have to contact my dealer to see. Or I was part of the 'testing new software' phase before a TSB is issued.

[Rimcrim]

Thanks!

 

Looks like this is just a reprogram of the PCM.

My shifting is alright, but sometimes the gears do hang for a while and doesn't feel like it selects the right gear, so maybe I'll get them to reprogram it and see if it helps.

[TomCinMI]

@Sage, thank you so very much! ?

[vmaxbaby]

Finally I hope this is the issue and the guys that get it done can post up their thoughts before and after the FLASH.    Would like to know if it goes in 8th gear during a highway drive or hangs in 7th.  And does it shift any faster from a dead stop to 60 mph? 

 

[Perblue]

I have mine booked in monday afternoon to hopefully have them flash the pcm. Since the nicer weather has shown up I've been noticing many of these issues. I guess babying it in the winter months hid it.

[TomCinMI]

16 hours ago, Perblue said:

I have mine booked in monday afternoon to hopefully have them flash the pcm. Since the nicer weather has shown up I've been noticing many of these issues. I guess babying it in the winter months hid it.

 

I took delivery on Nov. 2, "breaking in" (so to speak) all the way through the polar vortex until, finally, this break in the MI weather. While in "D", where I tend to keep the vehicle, & with my trans cold, it has tended to rev-hang/buck when going from 2nd to 3rd, & less so going from 1st to 2nd, but is otherwise very close to smooth; warming it up makes a big difference, with virtually no hang/hesitation anywhere through the gears. I've recently paid closer attention--with the stereo off. Also, when commenting on this stuff we do well to specify whether we were in "D" or "S", since in "S" the engineers intend for the trans to stay in the revs longer when in certain gears.

 

I'm sure I'm sleep deprived, or something, but how do some of you know for sure whether you're transitioning from 7th gear to 8th? My shifts are barely discernible, if at all, above about 4th ... while in "D"; the current gear isn't shown in the display unless using the paddles.

Edited April 5, 2019 by TomCinMI

[jamie1073]

Getting an oil change Tuesday so I am having this done as well. 

[Fingernip]

18 hours ago, TomCinMI said:

 

I took delivery on Nov. 2, "breaking in" (so to speak) all the way through the polar vortex until, finally, this break in the MI weather. While in "D", where I tend to keep the vehicle, & with my trans cold, it has tended to rev-hang/buck when going from 2nd to 3rd, & less so going from 1st to 2nd, but is otherwise very close to smooth; warming it up makes a big difference, with virtually no hang/hesitation anywhere through the gears. I've recently paid closer attention--with the stereo off. Also, when commenting on this stuff we do well to specify whether we were in "D" or "S", since in "S" the engineers intend for the trans to stay in the revs longer when in certain gears.

 

I'm sure I'm sleep deprived, or something, but how do some of you know for sure whether you're transitioning from 7th gear to 8th? My shifts are barely discernible, if at all, above about 4th ... while in "D"; the current gear isn't shown in the display unless using the paddles.

Mine when cold will flare 2-3 badly but no buck. Once warm it bucks 2-3 as if it is a standard and the revs were too high reengaging the clutch. It’s obvious even for people outside as it rocks the entire car 

[Aarm0ndd]

I ended up tuning my ST with livernois. It does shift much better now as well as a bit more power. Hoping they keep coming out with different revisions. They were also super quick on getting the tune to me even after hours. 

[TomCinMI]

On 4/5/2019 at 4:13 PM, jamie1073 said:

Getting an oil change Tuesday so I am having this done as well. 

 

We'll look forward to hearing your impressions afterward, please.

[Sage]

I also have 

15 hours ago, Aarm0ndd said:

I ended up tuning my ST with livernois. It does shift much better now as well as a bit more power. Hoping they keep coming out with different revisions. They were also super quick on getting the tune to me even after hours. 

 

Just my opinion, others may feel different.  I also have this tune, started with version 2, now on version 3.  2 helped with the shifting and 3 made it a bit better.  

[Perblue]

Just had mine done. Initial impressions are good. Shifts seem better especially in sport they seem firmer, but I guess time will tell since I'm guessing it will have to relearn things again. 

 

At 50 mph it stays in 7th gear steadily, will not go into 8th but likely not needed, and doing 70 mph it stayed in 8th with no problems even with a head wind. I didn't check if I had the same problem as Jamie before but it definitely doesn't bounce between 7th and 8th now. I did a highway mileage test at 70mph for about 20 miles I had a tail wind one way, 34 mpg, and a head wind the other, 24 mpg. 

[TomCinMI]

On 4/1/2019 at 2:56 PM, Fingernip said:

Brought my car in this morning and the dealer just called me to say they have reproduced my concern and have a solenoid replacement repair recommended by the ford dealer service forum community. They are ordering the parts now and will release the car to me as we wait for the parts to arrive. They mentioned that it is a wide spread problem that seems to effect a large portion of this model and they have no word if Ford is planning to release a TSB or not. I asked if they can disclose all of there findings and investigation so I can share it here and they agreed. 

 

Again, much thanks. You posted that 7 days ago, & I don't know how close the solenoids are to coming in, but when they do, if you would please ask where other dealers would be able to locate that particular service forum thread, that would be awesome.

 

I hope that since then you've noticed the pic of the actual TSB for a PCM-reprogram which Sage was great about posting; apparently another fix for very similar issues.

Edited April 9, 2019 by TomCinMI

[Fingernip]

36 minutes ago, TomCinMI said:

 

Again, much thanks. You posted that 7 days ago, & I don't know how close the solenoids are to coming in, but when they do, if you would please ask where other dealers would be able to locate that particular service forum thread, that would be awesome.

 

I hope that since then you've noticed the pic of the actual TSB for a PCM-reprogram which Sage was great about posting; apparently another fix for very similar issues.

The part is in and I have an appointment to bring the car in on Wednesday 4/10/19. I asked about the TSB over the phone on the day it was posted and was told there is also a note about it. So they will be trying both methods if the solenoid doesn’t fix it. 

[TomCinMI]

1 hour ago, Fingernip said:

The part is in and I have an appointment to bring the car in on Wednesday 4/10/19. I asked about the TSB over the phone on the day it was posted and was told there is also a note about it. So they will be trying both methods if the solenoid doesn’t fix it. 

 

Great. We sure will love hearing how that plays out. Please ask them where to locate the service-forum thread which mentions the solenoid fix, thanks; jamie1073 is interested in that, too.

 

Seems like since the TSB should be valid, regardless, even if the solenoid helps, the PCM-reprogram should still be done.

Edited April 9, 2019 by TomCinMI

[Fingernip]

Just picked up my car and so far seems better. I can still feel some herky jerky downshifts and upshifts but seems better. The tech was already gone and hadn’t finished his report so I am supposed to get the paperwork tomorrow morning. They didn’t want to leave me without the car tonight so they let me come get it early. I haven’t gone far though (6 miles) so I’ll drive it a bit and wait for the report and I’ll let everyone know the full outcome. 

[jamie1073]

Well I got the TSB performed.  First impressions are as follows.  It seems to shift better all around and more firm.  Also seems that the throttle is a little more responsive in Normal mode, closer to what Sport mode gives you.  I can now bounce with the paddles between 7 and 8 at 65 mph which I could not do before, if it was in 8 and I dropped down to 7 it would not go back to 8.  Also it always shifts to 8 now at over 55-60 mph, no more wonder if it will or not.  Of course it could all be because it was reset and needs to learn or maybe that I drop my dad's Escape with a 2.0T for a day.  Lol.  All in all with a few drives back and forth to work today, I go home to let the dogs out during the day, it seems to be a night and day difference and the throttle in driving around town seemed more responsive.  Even the instant mpg seems better like it is locking the TC sooner or more or something.  Seems to be locked in better all around.  Only time will tell as it 'learns' but I hope it stays close to the way it is right now. 

[vmaxbaby]

Great feedback Jamie1073 please give an update in a week or so.   One question so it runs better in Drive did it make any difference in Sport mode?  

[jamie1073]

55 minutes ago, vmaxbaby said:

Great feedback Jamie1073 please give an update in a week or so.   One question so it runs better in Drive did it make any difference in Sport mode?  

 

I did not try it yet really.  I will though.  It seems that there could be some tweaks to engine management but it could just be some throttle changes and it feels more connected now.  It just seems there is a much sportier feel with the throttle/engine/transmission responsiveness.  Hopefully it is not just because it needs to learn or something.  It feels better and still smooth, just get actual response when you push the gas down.  Even from a stop, which is where I noticed it most during my normal drive, slipped the rears a little without flooring it, just an aggressive takeoff. 

[TomCinMI]

6 hours ago, Fingernip said:

Just picked up my car and so far seems better. I can still feel some herky jerky downshifts and upshifts but seems better. The tech was already gone and hadn’t finished his report so I am supposed to get the paperwork tomorrow morning. They didn’t want to leave me without the car tonight so they let me come get it early. I haven’t gone far though (6 miles) so I’ll drive it a bit and wait for the report and I’ll let everyone know the full outcome. 

 

Thanks. After checking out the paperwork, when you report further, please mention whether they did the TSB's PCM-reprogram or just the solenoid replacement. And was the dealer able to direct you to the service-forum thread about the solenoid fix, so our other dealers won't have to stumble around trying to find it?

[TomCinMI]

As we await Fingernip's update, & any others, a few minutes ago I did a web search for "Ford 8F57 transmission", which returned links to the following two interesting articles/engineer-interview, the second linked within the first; there's some overlap between them, & some separate insights:

 

https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2018/10/ford-talks-edge-st-strengths-and-weaknesses/

 

https://www.motortrend.com/news/interview-ford-performance-engineer-on-2019-ford-edge-st/

 

Those are back from October, yet I hadn't run across them until now, & the transmission is a main focus. BTW, in approx. a week I expect to get both the TSB addressed & an oil change with Mobil 1 Annual Protection full synthetic; FYI, the mobiloil.com site has a promo going for $12 off of a 5-quart jug from any one of several retailers; the dealer's good with my bringing the oil in.