So Is All The Youtube Videos True

[Sage]

I have posted to this thread before, but.  I do not know if a PCM flash just starts the learn process over or if Ford updated(?) the PCM that is being used now(is that possible?).  I do feel a software update could/would help the shifting of our trans.  

 

The reason I feel this way, I have a LMS tune and my trans shifts better than it ever did.  It is not as fast as a speeding bullet or a DCT(and will never be), but a lot better.  Ford should be able to do the same and very well may be working on it.  

 

Just my opinion 

[jamie1073]

1 hour ago, TomCinMI said:

 

How do you figure that 6 seconds to 60 is slow, let alone it being off by about 0.1 sec compared to the Sport? Never mind. Rhetorical question.

 

Some have posted it is 5.7, reviewers post that.  Which is pretty damn quick for a 4600lbs SUV.  The stock Focus ST was only said to be able to hit 60 in 6.2 seconds, according to the same reviewers.  I would say the Edge St is quick.  Would it be nice if it was .1 or ,2 seconds quicker.  Sure.  Maybe they will get the software right and it will be due to a hair quicker shifts.  My complaints though are not about the 0-60 they are about the strange and inconsistent shifts and actions of this unit.  Heck sometimes it will shift to 8th and other it will not, on the same road, same speed, same everything.  Sometimes it just hesitates for seconds to make a shift just hanging in limbo.  Other times it does not downshift and decides turning 250RPMs does not necessitate a downshift even with the gas pedal on the floor, other times it does downshift and it adds to the smiles.  I know it is not a manual but still I have been driving for 30 years and this is becoming the worst I have had a trans shift and I expect a new computer controlled unit to do a tad better.   

[vmaxbaby]

This is why I created this post I wanted to hear from real people (owners of the ST) not someone trying to pump up their hits on youtube to make more money.  There has been some very honest reviews of it especially the guy that put the car on the lift and walked under it explaining it doesn't have allot of change.  In fact I subscribed to his channel now just because he seems like a stand up guy.  Winter is all but over here in Virginia and my plan was to pull the trigger April or May but because of the honest reviews from this forum I can't do it.  Spending 40+K thousand on a vehicle I can do !  (did it for my Shelby) but spending that much and knowing up front from not just one person but from allot, and video's to back it up that the transmission is flawed somehow well that puts me in a holding pattern.  This isn't my hotrod and have come to grips with a custom exhaust and tune is about all I could do to it which is fine,  never had any plans on bigger turbo, blow off valve, intercooler, etc. because this isn't my hotrod... BUT if I am driving down the same stretch of road and one day it shifts to 8th and the next stays in 7th and nothing I can do to force it to 8th well that will just cause me allot of stress and my local dealer will be hating me because I will be there all the time wanted it fixed,  and I know as of right now I would be better off asking someone at Ace Hardware if they could fix the problem because it doesn't sound like there is a fix.   And with this forum, the other Forum, youtube I  have a hard time thinking Ford doesn't know there is a problem but yet they don't seem to be talking about it sending a letter to the current owners about it.  Maybe they are thinking nobody will notice or those that do will just say "Oh Well  I love the Edge so I can live with it. "  Sadly I am not that person after spending this much money.   DC autoshow is now just 2 weeks away and I am going to the Ford booth early and can't wait to see if they admit a problem about the car or not.  I am a FORD guy,  8 mustangs, 2 trucks, 3 focuses, 1 thunderbird, and a ford taurus so I bleed blue so believe me I want the ST to be a success  I love the looks,  I love the size of it,  it is just the perfect vehicle.  I don't care the dash has hard plastic, or the other minor things about it others have said.  But a faulty trans that is a show stopper for me.  I do want to thank everyone for their input and also didn't want to start a feud on here with this question.  People have opinions and the freedom to them especially when being ask a question so I do thank you all for the feedback and the passionate feed back is still good feed back.  I am on here every night reading everyone's post so hopefully  there will be a post "TRANS FIXED FINALLY" and inside that post will be a TSB that does what it was suppose to and everyone gives it a huge thumbs up   

[Perblue]

The 8th gear seems to be like many trans with multiple overdrive gears or cars with cylinder deactivation. It gets used in very specific conditions and something as little as a head wind can affect it. This really isn't anything new. 

 

As for shifting I've gotten to play around more with the nicer weather and snow mostly gone. It doesn't always downshift when you want it to but I have had that in every automatic I've ever driven and has always been a complaint of mine of automatics so I can't say it's the edges fault. Maybe it'll learn with the nicer weather or it'll change whenever I decide to get it flashed but I may wait a couple more months before I do that to give them time to tweak it that much more. 

[Nick Halstead]

4 hours ago, TomCinMI said:

 

How do you figure that 6 seconds to 60 is slow, let alone it being off by about 0.1 sec compared to the Sport? Never mind. Rhetorical question.

in today's world, it's a below average time. I'm not even putting it down either cause nobody expects a SUV to even pull that time. I can tell you, my Sport pulls a 7sec 0-60 stock and tuned on the horrible Hankooks pulls a 6.3. Swapped to Toyo Proxes and pulled a 5.6. Still nothing compared to the 4.6 GT500 was pulling in his tuned AWD Sport. Transmission is just blah. huge disconnect with car and driver. When I'm in my sport, which I haven't seen in a year almost really, It's just put in S and drive and mash the gas when I want to go fast.

[Nick Halstead]

2 hours ago, vmaxbaby said:

This is why I created this post I wanted to hear from real people (owners of the ST) not someone trying to pump up their hits on youtube to make more money.  There has been some very honest reviews of it especially the guy that put the car on the lift and walked under it explaining it doesn't have allot of change.  In fact I subscribed to his channel now just because he seems like a stand up guy.  Winter is all but over here in Virginia and my plan was to pull the trigger April or May but because of the honest reviews from this forum I can't do it.  Spending 40+K thousand on a vehicle I can do !  (did it for my Shelby) but spending that much and knowing up front from not just one person but from allot, and video's to back it up that the transmission is flawed somehow well that puts me in a holding pattern.  This isn't my hotrod and have come to grips with a custom exhaust and tune is about all I could do to it which is fine,  never had any plans on bigger turbo, blow off valve, intercooler, etc. because this isn't my hotrod... BUT if I am driving down the same stretch of road and one day it shifts to 8th and the next stays in 7th and nothing I can do to force it to 8th well that will just cause me allot of stress and my local dealer will be hating me because I will be there all the time wanted it fixed,  and I know as of right now I would be better off asking someone at Ace Hardware if they could fix the problem because it doesn't sound like there is a fix.   And with this forum, the other Forum, youtube I  have a hard time thinking Ford doesn't know there is a problem but yet they don't seem to be talking about it sending a letter to the current owners about it.  Maybe they are thinking nobody will notice or those that do will just say "Oh Well  I love the Edge so I can live with it. "  Sadly I am not that person after spending this much money.   DC autoshow is now just 2 weeks away and I am going to the Ford booth early and can't wait to see if they admit a problem about the car or not.  I am a FORD guy,  8 mustangs, 2 trucks, 3 focuses, 1 thunderbird, and a ford taurus so I bleed blue so believe me I want the ST to be a success  I love the looks,  I love the size of it,  it is just the perfect vehicle.  I don't care the dash has hard plastic, or the other minor things about it others have said.  But a faulty trans that is a show stopper for me.  I do want to thank everyone for their input and also didn't want to start a feud on here with this question.  People have opinions and the freedom to them especially when being ask a question so I do thank you all for the feedback and the passionate feed back is still good feed back.  I am on here every night reading everyone's post so hopefully  there will be a post "TRANS FIXED FINALLY" and inside that post will be a TSB that does what it was suppose to and everyone gives it a huge thumbs up   

Your post pretty much sums up why I said a "new" 2018 Edge Sport was a better financial buy than a 2019 ST. A lot cheaper and dealers trying to clear stock. Not because I don't like the ST, but first year problems are a bitch, I own a first year Sport, it  spent 7 months (1 month, 1 month, 3 months, 2 months is how long I had rentals) at the dealer getting an irregular transmission housing diagnosed cause nobody could figure the problem out. Finally after Ford made 3 car payments for me, they found the hairline cracks in the housing. (getting off topic here...and just rambling now) My dealer experience was horrible, it used to be great and then my usual service writer left and it was all down here from there, My Edge even got a service writer fired. Prior to that, was all great, I've owned 3 Fords ( I don't have a fav manufacturer) since 2011. 13 Edge, 11 Fusion and 15 Edge, unless some crazy shit happens, it probably stops at my Sport. I test drove a ST, pushed the hell out of it and the transmission was a let down. Wife really wanted the ST to get out of our FWD Sport. Though I have no plans to get rid of it, like you said, it's the perfect size, specially for my needs, Wife got off plane in San Diego from Hawaii and her and my teenage kids, 75lb lab and 2 cats drove all the way to Virginia Beach with no issues, so atleast I know the transmission is fixed. I don't need 3 rows. If the explorer was 2 rows, that would be amazing! Specially a 2 row explorer ST, the same size. Now I'm just dreaming. lol

Edited March 27, 2019 by Nick Halstead

[TomCinMI]

2 hours ago, vmaxbaby said:

This is why I created this post I wanted to hear from real people (owners of the ST) not someone trying to pump up their hits on youtube to make more money.  There has been some very honest reviews of it especially the guy that put the car on the lift and walked under it explaining it doesn't have allot of change.  In fact I subscribed to his channel now just because he seems like a stand up guy.  Winter is all but over here in Virginia and my plan was to pull the trigger April or May but because of the honest reviews from this forum I can't do it.  Spending 40+K thousand on a vehicle I can do !  (did it for my Shelby) but spending that much and knowing up front from not just one person but from allot, and video's to back it up that the transmission is flawed somehow well that puts me in a holding pattern.  This isn't my hotrod and have come to grips with a custom exhaust and tune is about all I could do to it which is fine,  never had any plans on bigger turbo, blow off valve, intercooler, etc. because this isn't my hotrod... BUT if I am driving down the same stretch of road and one day it shifts to 8th and the next stays in 7th and nothing I can do to force it to 8th well that will just cause me allot of stress and my local dealer will be hating me because I will be there all the time wanted it fixed,  and I know as of right now I would be better off asking someone at Ace Hardware if they could fix the problem because it doesn't sound like there is a fix.   And with this forum, the other Forum, youtube I  have a hard time thinking Ford doesn't know there is a problem but yet they don't seem to be talking about it sending a letter to the current owners about it.  Maybe they are thinking nobody will notice or those that do will just say "Oh Well  I love the Edge so I can live with it. "  Sadly I am not that person after spending this much money.   DC autoshow is now just 2 weeks away and I am going to the Ford booth early and can't wait to see if they admit a problem about the car or not.  I am a FORD guy,  8 mustangs, 2 trucks, 3 focuses, 1 thunderbird, and a ford taurus so I bleed blue so believe me I want the ST to be a success  I love the looks,  I love the size of it,  it is just the perfect vehicle.  I don't care the dash has hard plastic, or the other minor things about it others have said.  But a faulty trans that is a show stopper for me.  I do want to thank everyone for their input and also didn't want to start a feud on here with this question.  People have opinions and the freedom to them especially when being ask a question so I do thank you all for the feedback and the passionate feed back is still good feed back.  I am on here every night reading everyone's post so hopefully  there will be a post "TRANS FIXED FINALLY" and inside that post will be a TSB that does what it was suppose to and everyone gives it a huge thumbs up   

 

@vmaxbaby, I notice that you haven't posted to the other most active thread on this ST forum, the one entitled "Poor trans shifting theory investigation". There appears to be worthwhile mention there of an available Power-train Control Module update, which shows up on a diagnostics scan but may not have a TSB # assigned; word is that it's been very helpful. Scope out the thread.

[MaX83_ZA]

17 hours ago, vmaxbaby said:

This is why I created this post I wanted to hear from real people (owners of the ST) not someone trying to pump up their hits on youtube to make more money.  There has been some very honest reviews of it especially the guy that put the car on the lift and walked under it explaining it doesn't have allot of change.  In fact I subscribed to his channel now just because he seems like a stand up guy.

 

If you are like me, you will end up watching all of his previous videos. I sub'ed to SavegeGeese probably 2 years ago and think he is one of only a hand full of guys that truly understand what it means to review a car. Like I said, I dont care much for his subjective views on styling and even engine tuning, but the rest of it is solid!

[jamie1073]

21 hours ago, vmaxbaby said:

This is why I created this post I wanted to hear from real people (owners of the ST) not someone trying to pump up their hits on youtube to make more money.  There has been some very honest reviews of it especially the guy that put the car on the lift and walked under it explaining it doesn't have allot of change.  In fact I subscribed to his channel now just because he seems like a stand up guy.  Winter is all but over here in Virginia and my plan was to pull the trigger April or May but because of the honest reviews from this forum I can't do it.  Spending 40+K thousand on a vehicle I can do !  (did it for my Shelby) but spending that much and knowing up front from not just one person but from allot, and video's to back it up that the transmission is flawed somehow well that puts me in a holding pattern.  This isn't my hotrod and have come to grips with a custom exhaust and tune is about all I could do to it which is fine,  never had any plans on bigger turbo, blow off valve, intercooler, etc. because this isn't my hotrod... BUT if I am driving down the same stretch of road and one day it shifts to 8th and the next stays in 7th and nothing I can do to force it to 8th well that will just cause me allot of stress and my local dealer will be hating me because I will be there all the time wanted it fixed,  and I know as of right now I would be better off asking someone at Ace Hardware if they could fix the problem because it doesn't sound like there is a fix.   And with this forum, the other Forum, youtube I  have a hard time thinking Ford doesn't know there is a problem but yet they don't seem to be talking about it sending a letter to the current owners about it.  Maybe they are thinking nobody will notice or those that do will just say "Oh Well  I love the Edge so I can live with it. "  Sadly I am not that person after spending this much money.   DC autoshow is now just 2 weeks away and I am going to the Ford booth early and can't wait to see if they admit a problem about the car or not.  I am a FORD guy,  8 mustangs, 2 trucks, 3 focuses, 1 thunderbird, and a ford taurus so I bleed blue so believe me I want the ST to be a success  I love the looks,  I love the size of it,  it is just the perfect vehicle.  I don't care the dash has hard plastic, or the other minor things about it others have said.  But a faulty trans that is a show stopper for me.  I do want to thank everyone for their input and also didn't want to start a feud on here with this question.  People have opinions and the freedom to them especially when being ask a question so I do thank you all for the feedback and the passionate feed back is still good feed back.  I am on here every night reading everyone's post so hopefully  there will be a post "TRANS FIXED FINALLY" and inside that post will be a TSB that does what it was suppose to and everyone gives it a huge thumbs up   

 

The 7 or 8th gear thing is more of an annoyance of mine since I am getting crap gas mileage.  It does drop like 300 rpm cruising at 65 with that upshift so who knows maybe it would help a little in my case.  But it does shift fine into 8th when cruising at 75 or even 70.  The trans most likely just needs a program update to fix most issues mentioned.  The delay I get seems to be it not knowing if it wants 2nd or 3rd gear or something.  It eventually gets there but it is bothersome.  Maybe iut is just me because while I obey, for the most part, traffic laws I do push it as far as I can without getting a ticket.  I like to accelerate, I like to feel the boost hit and the vehicle accelerate.  It pulls nicely so I enjoy it.  I like to floor it.  So maybe the trans just does not know what I want it to do.  I guess I could just drive in Sport all the time but when I get cruising speed I would need to turn it off so it shifts to the highest gear for that speed.  So it is turning on when taking off and then back off when I am at speed and that is just silly.  It would be nice if the Advance Trac setting to Sport Mode would adjust the throttle response to that of Sport Mode and leave the trans shifting normal, I guess I want the best of both modes.  I love the vehicle but it could be better and I guess I expect more from a $45K+ vehicle.  Right down to the fake exhaust noise, why not just put a better exhaust on it.  Grrrrr. 

[erikrichard]

On 3/25/2019 at 10:09 PM, TomCinMI said:

 

Keep telling yourself that; won't make it true. About just one of the lesser-mentioned features, post-collision braking: If one is involved in a wreck that's none of his/her fault, there's always the potential of ricocheting off into another lane of traffic--very possibly oncoming traffic--unless post-collision braking kicks in, so the vehicle automatically brakes upon first impact; that's one of countless scenarios which have nothing to do with being "lazy/inattentive".

Sounds cool, will enjoy having that feature (however useless it actually is) when I buy a 2019 Edge in 10 years for $10k. Maybe it will be yours - if so thanks in advance for paying off $40k worth of depreciation! 

Edited March 28, 2019 by erikrichard

[Fingernip]

7 hours ago, erikrichard said:

Sounds cool, will enjoy having that feature (however useless it actually is) when I buy a 2019 Edge in 10 years for $10k. Maybe it will be yours - if so thanks in advance for paying off $40k worth of depreciation! 

You can enjoy his countless sneezes and piles of skin cells he left for you. Also the no longer supported FordPass and useless navigation maps while he rides his  equity wave and keeps driving a safe, reliable and modern vehicle. I will never own a used car as my primary vehicle. For me a beater or work truck is the only way I buy used now a day. 

[akirby]

This debate is silly.  It’s always cheaper to buy a used vehicle - the older it is the cheaper it is.  It’s also more worn out, more expensive to fix, has outdated electronics, little or no warranty, can be harder to get parts, etc.

 

It all depends on what is more important to you.  If you prefer driving newer vehicles and you can afford it then great.

If you prefer to buy older ones to save money, great.

 

Neither position is wrong.

[Nick Halstead]

6 hours ago, akirby said:

This debate is silly.  It’s always cheaper to buy a used vehicle - the older it is the cheaper it is.  It’s also more worn out, more expensive to fix, has outdated electronics, little or no warranty, can be harder to get parts, etc.

 

It all depends on what is more important to you.  If you prefer driving newer vehicles and you can afford it then great.

If you prefer to buy older ones to save money, great.

 

Neither position is wrong.

I agree here, a decade old car is gonna need maint. I'm not afraid to buy new, and not afraid to buy 1-2 years old with low mileage. Having someone else absorb the initial depreciation is a great asset also.

Edited March 29, 2019 by Nick Halstead

[erikrichard]

18 hours ago, Fingernip said:

You can enjoy his countless sneezes and piles of skin cells he left for you. Also the no longer supported FordPass and useless navigation maps while he rides his  equity wave and keeps driving a safe, reliable and modern vehicle. I will never own a used car as my primary vehicle. For me a beater or work truck is the only way I buy used now a day. 

Sneezes and skin cells aren't avoidable, massive depreciation hits are. I don't even mind the farts! (as long as he doesn't do it on the test drive)

Edited March 29, 2019 by erikrichard

[Sage]

For me, when I was able to, I purchased new and kept for 8 - 10 years.  Did the value drop driving off the lot, yep.  On the other end, I have always gotten more when selling it or trading it in.  When they find out I am the original owner and can show all the maintenance that has been done. Is it a wash, no, but after 8 - 10 years, I am ok with it.

 

Just my opinion

Edited March 29, 2019 by Sage

[vmaxbaby]

Certain cars I am okay buying used.  Mustangs NOPE I know how they are driven so everyone of mine have been new,  cars with turbo's as silly as it sounds I want knew so I know how the car was broken in.   Other cars used it fine.   Bought a 2016 Accord V6 for the wife (she is not the ford fan like me lol)  it had 8K miles on it.   Now has 42K and not one thing wrong and runs great.  I know I am going to take a hit buying new and if I was going to sell in 2 or 3 years that would suck, but I normally keep my daily driver for 5-8 years.  And like Sage says when reselling people like that is was bought new, garage kept, and have all the records.   Is buying new a great investment NO unless you bought a 2007-2009 Ford GT for 145K back than now it is worth allot more but sadly I couldn't afford one those

 

[Fingernip]

5 hours ago, erikrichard said:

Sneezes and skin cells aren't avoidable, massive depreciation hits are. I don't even mind the farts! (as long as he doesn't do it on the test drive)

You take a 90-100% hit on an older car owned 5-10 years. A new car depending on the Rarity will be 50-70%.  Even less for a really sought after model. Being just ratios though it obviously doesn’t reflect the true cost but for the sacrifice in modern/usable features it’s a trade off we all have to deal with. You can buy a Tandy 200 laptop today for $10 or could have got one 30 years ago for $1000. But what good is a 30 year old laptop? Either you enjoyed relevant use of an effective and efficient computer back when it was modern and new. Or save a ton an buy it as a relic. 

[erikrichard]

31 minutes ago, Fingernip said:

You take a 90-100% hit on an older car owned 5-10 years. A new car depending on the Rarity will be 50-70%.  Even less for a really sought after model. Being just ratios though it obviously doesn’t reflect the true cost but for the sacrifice in modern/usable features it’s a trade off we all have to deal with. You can buy a Tandy 200 laptop today for $10 or could have got one 30 years ago for $1000. But what good is a 30 year old laptop? Either you enjoyed relevant use of an effective and efficient computer back when it was modern and new. Or save a ton an buy it as a relic. 

 

A 30 year old computer wouldn't even be able to access the internet. A good running 30 year old car serves the same purpose a new car does, not a good comparison. 

[Fingernip]

5 minutes ago, erikrichard said:

 

A 30 year old computer wouldn't even be able to access the internet. A good running 30 year old car serves the same purpose a new car does, not a good comparison. 

I completely disagree. A 30 year old car also can’t access the internet while my 2019 has built in WiFi. A 30 year old computer is as capable as a 30 year old car. It can do math and spreadsheets fine. But it won’t run a modern game or cad software just as a 30 year old car won’t have sync3, fordpass, Apple car play and so on. It also won’t reach anywhere near the fuel efficiency or performance of a modern computer/car. They both serve the same purpose but progression has made one far superior. 

Edited March 30, 2019 by Fingernip

[Perblue]

3 minutes ago, erikrichard said:

 

A 30 year old computer wouldn't even be able to access the internet. A good running 30 year old car serves the same purpose a new car does, not a good comparison. 

 

That is actually a feature and there actually were modems back then. A computer does not have to have internet in order to run. You can still run programs and play games as archaic as they may be compared to roday.

 

5 minutes ago, Fingernip said:

I completely disagree. A 30 year old car also can’t access the internet while my 2019 has built in WiFi. A 30 year old computer is as capable as a 30 year old car. It can do math and spreadsheets fine. But it won’t run a modern game or cad software just as a 30 year old car won’t have sync3, fordpass, Apple car play and so on. It also won’t reach anywhere near the fuel efficiency or performance of a modern computer/car. They both serve the same purpose but progression has made one far superior. 

 

Beat me to it lol.

[erikrichard]

Hey, if you got monty to burn buy a brand new vehicle every couple years. Somebody's got to buy all the new cars, just ain't gonna be me.

[Fingernip]

7 hours ago, erikrichard said:

Hey, if you got monty to burn buy a brand new vehicle every couple years. Somebody's got to buy all the new cars, just ain't gonna be me.

The more frequent you buy new, the less hit you take due to residual value of the previous. You take all your loss on the first one and try to maintain 50%+ value from then on. I have been able to maintain the same $14,000 equity since my first new car. My gen 1.5 edge did well as I was able to keep it 8 years before depreciation caught up to the value I needed to maintain. If I had bought it 3 years used I would have had to flip it much sooner or take a total loss and start over. 

[TomCinMI]

On 3/28/2019 at 4:40 PM, erikrichard said:

Sounds cool, will enjoy having that feature (however useless it actually is) when I buy a 2019 Edge in 10 years for $10k. Maybe it will be yours - if so thanks in advance for paying off $40k worth of depreciation! 

 

You seem to be a contrarian who's just spoiling for an argument, facts be damned. As I said, "About just one of the lesser-mentioned features, post-collision braking: ...", just one of numerous very significant safety features which a 2010 vehicle does not have. $10K left after 10 years, without stipulating the mileage? That's good, representing a whole lot of usage of an overall excellent vehicle, inc. taking advantage of all the safety features--& only one occasion of needing them can save multiple lives; what dollar value do you place on those lives? As another poster noted, his 2011 Edge, as much as he/she loved it, can't hold a candle to the current version. Good luck with your DIY car maintenance/repair on such a sophisticated, tech-heavy vehicle in 10 years--& we "know" that there isn't a ton of time, or money, consumption in doing so--if you can find the parts. Time is money, & there's another applicable expression called "penny wise & pound foolish", so when the shoe fits, you need to ...

[TomCinMI]

20 hours ago, Nick Halstead said:

I agree here, a decade old car is gonna need maint. I'm not afraid to buy new, and not afraid to buy 1-2 years old with low mileage. Having someone else absorb the initial depreciation is a great asset also.

 

For you to suddenly come out with "I'm not afraid to buy new, and not afraid to buy 1-2 years old with low mileage" qualifies as ****BREAKING NEWS****. And having people out there snapping up "useds" boosts value retention, so more power to ya!*

 

*Edited: I briefly mistook Nick Halstead for erikrichard--but my point stands.

Edited March 30, 2019 by TomCinMI

[TomCinMI]

11 hours ago, erikrichard said:

Hey, if you got monty to burn buy a brand new vehicle every couple years. Somebody's got to buy all the new cars, just ain't gonna be me.

 

Obviously you're not gonna--no matter how high the quantum leap in safety features after 3 years of warranty. And a "couple years" is 2, not 3, although 2 retains more value.