Have you changed your water pump as preventive maintenance?

[Goldy]

I have a 2009 Ford Edge Limited AWD with 212,xxx miles. I bought it new and have meticulously maintained it. Other than the PTU going south around 150,000, it has basically been flawless (other than what I consider to be 'wear and tear' items).

 

It still has the original water pump which is currently (knock on wood) working fine. Should I consider replacing it even though it's working fine? My Ford dealership tells me not to worry about it...that they do not see many go bad, but 212,xxx is a lot of miles on a water pump.

 

Plz advise. Thx.

 

BTW - I'm not a fan of this 'internal water pump' engine design. It appears that serious engine damage can occur if/when the seal goes. Other than this, I have no complaints on the 3.5.

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

I would think 212K proves out the pump design But yes, maintenance cannot be ignored.

 

If you are willing to budget in, you have two choices: change the pump or change the engine entirely. This avoids major interruptions of your life should an event occur. And you have some savings stashed if it doesn't. Can't lose.

 

A periodic Blackstone Labs type engine oil analysis will let you know if there is looming danger. Some oils use sodium, so be aware that sodium in oil is ALSO used as an indicator of coolant presence in the oil.

[enigma-2]

I've considered this as well. I have a 2009 MKX with 112k. At this time, I still have an Basic extended warranty and it will cover a bad water pump or new engine. But after it runs out in a couple of years, if I continue to keep the car, I'll probably have the water pump, guides and timing chain replaced around 150k. At 200k your on borrowed time IMO.

[Gortty-Pilot]

I have a 2011 Edge and have considered this as well. The Edge has 156K and has been relatively maintenance free. The only items I replaced that weren't scheduled were the suspension components at 105K and the ride continues to remain smooth.

 

I called the Ford dealers in my area and got quotes from $1400-1700. Considering the cost and time of a replacement engine, Im thinking I may get the pump replaced around 170-180K. It may not need it, but if I keep the Edge past 250k, it will be peace of mind. I know there are several engines with more than 250k, but there are also several engines that never made it past 150k without a $2500 replacement engine. I figure the middle ground is around 200k.

Edited July 8, 2018 by Gortty-Pilot

[Goldy]

Thx for all the responses. Knock on wood, all is well right now. This has been weighing on my mind. You've all convinced me... I will plan on replacing the pump and timing components soon. Yes... it is cheaper than a new engine and does give peace of mind.

[enigma-2]

A periodic Blackstone Labs type engine oil analysis will let you know if there is looming danger. Some oils use sodium, so be aware that sodium in oil is ALSO used as an indicator of coolant presence in the oil.

I bought this tester to know when to change oil in my small engine equipment, but works perfectly to test for coolant in oil as well.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HBAG9AC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_IZfrBbX72PGFC

[I'manedgeowner]

WWWPerfA_ZN0W,

 

Are you a mechanic? Wondering if you have an opinion about the efficacy of those claiming to keep the maintenance up and experiencing pump failures? Just my nature but I take most claims with a grain of salt.

Edited July 10, 2018 by I'manedgeowner

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Not a mechanic by far, or even an engineer, LOL.

 

As far as the claims, all we have to go by is empirical evidence. macbwt bases his on experience with 3 Edges that he owns/has owned, and has a rigorous maintenance schedule. No WP/CP failures thus far. Also regularly has oil tested. Monitors powertrain with Forscan Lite daily. All things most people will NOT do, or will entrust to others thinking the work was done correctly. Cracking open the hood seems to become more of a lost art everyday, as claims of extended life products grow and spread like kudzu weed.

[enigma-2]

My dealer told be that it was their opinion that coolant played a major role in water pump failures. Ford also put out a tech sheet (I've post a copy on this forum) advising to change orange to green due to their discovering that orange caused corrosion in the cooling system. All coolants break down and lose their corrosion protection as well. Changing will prevent this.

 

I've read on other forums that oil also played a role in failures due to causing excessive wear on the timing chain. A worn chain puts additional stress on the w.p. gear and bearing.

 

I should mention that Ford did change the timing chain guides (tensioner) to prevent chain slap (at leaSt that's what I've read).

 

It seems reasonable that maintenance is a prudent action to follow to extend the life of the water pump. (In-fact, it's the only action an owner can take). That and paying $1800 in preventative maintenance in changing the pump, chain and guides between 150-200k miles.

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

you mean gold to green, enigma? I must have missed the corrosion with orange posting?

[enigma-2]

Yup. I get it wrong every time. (sigh).

At least I'm consistant.

[macbwt]

I am still driving to see how long will a water pump go until failure with good maintenance. Currently over 243,000 miles on LU (2011 Ford Edge).

[Decojuicer]

Last year, I put a used engine into my 2010 Edge SEL. in order to activate the warranty on the used engine, I had to install a new timing set and water pump. It wasnt easy to do, and I cant imagine trying to do it with the engine still in the vehicle.

[erikrichard]

I've done some searches and found nothing. Has anyone added a coolant level sensor to the expansion tank and maybe wiring it in to the wiper fluid level switch? This seems like a lot simpler solution than just changing the water pump as preventative maintenance, especially when you have posters here with over 250k on original water pumps. My thought is that these pumps don't just go at once, filling the crankcase with coolant and a minute later the engine is trashed. I think in all cases every trashed engine could have been saved with a low coolant warning, just going on my experiences with coolant in the oil and it being caught in time.

Edited August 27, 2018 by erikrichard

[mike dexter]

You're right, there is a progression of events. It starts with unexplained loss of coolant, and coolant in the oil. The former, you could just visually check the coolant level (when cold) on the degas bottle every time you open the hood. To check for the latter, take off your oil fill cap and look for a milkshake consistency, instead of the regular amber or black oil color.

[erikrichard]

You're right, there is a progression of events. It starts with unexplained loss of coolant, and coolant in the oil. The former, you could just visually check the coolant level (when cold) on the degas bottle every time you open the hood. To check for the latter, take off your oil fill cap and look for a milkshake consistency, instead of the regular amber or black oil color.

Water pumps seal and bearing failures typically leak over time, not all at once. Catastropic failures can dump all the coolant in a very short time, but I think a level warning would save engines even in this rare event - engines don't suffer catastrophic damage instantly, pulling over immediately should save it. I don't think checking the level every few hundred miles is good enough, what we need is a level sensor in the expansion tank that triggers an obvious warning light on the dash - similar to what BMW uses.

Even installing a new pump at mileage intervals is no guarantee - even new pumps can fail if they came new with a flaw. The only way to protect our engines against what Ford has stupidly done here is to install a level sensor - I'm currently researching the best one to use and how to wire it to the dash.

Edited August 29, 2018 by erikrichard

[macbwt]

I Know at least one person that discovered a coolant issue through oil testing and this saved his engine.

[1320INC]

New member here so take my post with a grain of salt. We own a 2010 with 175,000 on it. Never done a thing to it coolant-wise.(however I'm gonna flush and fill now!) It has the green in it. However I just bought a 2011 with the orange in it that has a blown motor at 71,000 miles.( I bought it this way) I am an advocate of over maintaining as coolant changes are much cheaper than engines. I am swapping a 2014 engine into the 2011 and tried to post pics earlier but I think they are too big. I have a friend who is a Master Ford tech an he told me that they switched to the Orange coolant to eliminate "hot spots" in the engine block. He says BS on the reasoning. 

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

A 2011 with orange coolant?  Interesting.  Probably a late MY 2011, build date of 7/11/2011 or later.

[DoubleTap]

Several items in this old topic that has brought me back to browse and learn. 

Bought wife a new 2008 Edge Limited FWD that currently has 208,000 miles on it. Has had early flush and refill TSB done at 70K miles, heater core failed at 105K and was covered by extended warranty Ford offered with the flush and fill. Cooling fan control module and fans were replaced about 150K. I have done regular oil changes averaging 7K mile intervals always using 5-20 Motorcraft Syn Blend and MC filters. Currently it has heater problems and yellow coolant. (Not sure when Ford suggested dark green coolant)

Last week a person at a gas station told my wife he had an identical Orange Limited FWD sitting in his yard his sister parked 1 year ago due to engine problems. Ours having damaged Limited aluminum 20" wheels and some other good parts I looked it over and bought it for cheap. It has 138K miles and water in the oil but otherwise nice condition. (Has build date of 10/07 vs ours 1/08.)

Making a long story short, research on forums has made me aware of the water pump time bomb and making me think PM is a good idea. We are going to keep one or both of them to pull behind our motorhome and local driver for me to keep miles off my new Super Duty. Am going to do Blackstone as suggested earlier on the 208K unit, have used them lots for diesel units over the years.

Looking for comments on engine swap in the lower mileage Edge vs $1300 on water pump / timing chain PM.

 

P.S. Best repair ever on the 208K mile Edge not mentioned was driver side motor mount. Made it drive like a new one.

[flymore]

On 7/6/2018 at 11:36 PM, Goldy said:

I have a 2009 Ford Edge Limited AWD with 212,xxx miles. I bought it new and have meticulously maintained it. Other than the PTU going south around 150,000, it has basically been flawless (other than what I consider to be 'wear and tear' items).

 

It still has the original water pump which is currently (knock on wood) working fine. Should I consider replacing it even though it's working fine? My Ford dealership tells me not to worry about it...that they do not see many go bad, but 212,xxx is a lot of miles on a water pump.

 

Plz advise. Thx.

 

BTW - I'm not a fan of this 'internal water pump' engine design. It appears that serious engine damage can occur if/when the seal goes. Other than this, I have no complaints on the 3.5.

 

I'm new to Ford and just recently purchased a CPO 2018 3.5L with AWD and enjoying it very much.

You say the PTU failed at 150,000 did you service the PTU during it's life? If so when?

Many recommend the PTU be serviced, but I discussed this with the dealer asked them to service the PTU but they insisted it doesn't need servicing till 100,000 miles.

 

Fyi, my Chevy pickup 4.3L v6 drank some antifreeze most of it's life through the intake manifold.  This is common.

Just saying that if the antifreeze is disappearing it may not necessarily going into the crankcase.

 

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

There is no factory recommendation for PTU service intervals.  Despite the introduction of a drain plug in Gen 2, the fluid is "lifetime".

 

The dealer should be able to perform PTU flushes if you insist on it, pointing out that your Gen 2 has a factory drain plug.  Otherwise, change dealers.

 

Antifreeze in the 3.5/3.7 is typically lost via evaporation (degas bottle) or water pump leak into the oil.  Very rarely head gasket or any other condition.

[WhiteySue]

On ‎11‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 7:31 PM, 1320INC said:

New member here so take my post with a grain of salt. We own a 2010 with 175,000 on it. Never done a thing to it coolant-wise.(however I'm gonna flush and fill now!) It has the green in it. However I just bought a 2011 with the orange in it that has a blown motor at 71,000 miles.( I bought it this way) I am an advocate of over maintaining as coolant changes are much cheaper than engines. I am swapping a 2014 engine into the 2011 and tried to post pics earlier but I think they are too big. I have a friend who is a Master Ford tech an he told me that they switched to the Orange coolant to eliminate "hot spots" in the engine block. He says BS on the reasoning. 

I'm also concerned about this "water pump" issue. I have just purchased a used 2015 Edge SEL with Tri-Vct V6 AWD. Does this issue still exist in the newer model tri-vct engine?

Also I'm looking for advice on maintainence  such as when to service the transmission, the PTU and rear axle. I know what the owners manual says but I'd like to know how members feel about this? I plan on changing the oil when the oil monitor alerts or 8,000 kilometers, which ever comes first. Castrol "Edge" fully synthetic?  Thanks:  Dave