dustys318 Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Oh yeah, and Cobb only support 4 cylinder engines, I was hoping they'd come over but I'm sure they won't.. so SCT X4 will be the tuning solution for hard parts upgrades... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Halstead Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Yeah, we're going to have to wait until the F150 and Fusion Sport guys get rolling with good support before we get some trickle down tech. And as far as the $1800+ price tag goes it is safer, cheaper and more reliable than to get meth (constant maint, and subject to failure that may cause catastrophic engine failure - leaking nozzles is an example or clogged nozzles causing a lean condition) or getting aux fueling (fuel match from cylinder to cylinder isn't possible without port injection - and you'll be beyond $1800 after a separate tuning solution) but changing the fuel pump, turbos and intercooler then tuning is like the factory system. Over all thinking: $2000 for fuel pump upgrade $3000 for upgraded turbos $1500 for upgraded intercooler system (boost hoses, clamps, ect) $500 for tuner $300-500 for dyno/live driving tune (only need one permanent solution but Adam probably still does "tunes for life") $??? for quality fluids Roughly $7500 for a DD, reliable 500awhp on pump 91/93, I'm good with that... (paid $37800 in San Antonio, TX for my Edge Sport, then add $7500 to get to $45300 overall or 500awhp? What SUV can you buy new that has 600 crank hp for under $50k I hope you can make all that work! Really do. Looks like the Fusion Sport isn't getting any love either. I'm on that Forum also and well...they got about as much support as the Edge and it's coming on almost a year of being out. Upgrading the turbo's is going to be fun. Since they are mated to the block and the front turbo has ZERO room for a bigger one. So you may have to get custom manifolds made. Shit...actually as of right now, your whole setup would be custom. When Edge first came out I got a quote for like 2500 for custom intercooler setup with hoses/etc since it would have been a one off...said fuck that I'll wait. Well here 2 years later and I'm still waiting and the Fusion uses a totally different intercooler setup so can't even use one made for them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWPerfA_ZN0W Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Dusty, if you are willing for your Edge to be a "lab rat", you can talk to/message Mike Bambic / EcoPowerParts.com, see if he can set up a custom whatever-you-need that evolves into a group buy. He has developed aux fueling including PFI setup for the SHO 3.5EB, and that is just one of many performance upgrades he came up with. He also worked with Black Market Racing in the past, not sure if he still does. Based in AZ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 You guys would be in heaven in my part of the country. We have E85 stations everywhere with E85 selling for as cheap as $1.49 a gallon right now. Everytime I pass them, I almost never see anything other than the occasional Subie WRX at the yellow pump. Supposedly there is good aftermarket E85 support for Subies. I am curious to see what is coming as there is not very much demand for performance stuff like there are for SHO's and Fusion Sports. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustys318 Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 Yeah, we got E85 here too and it's about that same price, good stuff if tuned for it! My bud kept his CP-E intercooler from his Focus ST and his factory intercooler from his 335i and plans on digging them out of storage this weekend to bring it over to size it up on the lift. Hopefully we have a "core" starting point with one of those intercoolers. Ridiculous that Ford uses the same intercooler (size) for both 2.0 and 2.7. We really need to start here, a couple hard runs and the intercooler is done (heat soak), it was the same issue on my Fiesta ST and his Focus ST. It gets too hot here in El Paso over the summer to wait... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustys318 Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 Don't want to do the "lab rat" thing again. If you look on the Fiesta ST forum I was the "lab rat" for the Cyborg turbo system (stock frame with compressor wheel bigger than the one in the Focus ST) with the factory manifold milled and welded for an external wastegate, too many tuning issues with it. The Stratified single injector auxiliary fueling was a tuning issue too because we couldn't get the fuel to balance cylinder to cylinder (manifold is a "dry flow" and adding "wet" caused issues - it's why they came out with the port style later). I'm going to wait on the HPFP upgraded pump solution before any other hard part change take place. DeadHook Motorsports (DHM) has done a similar "cyborg" type turbo but they call it the ST280 (for Fiesta ST). I think if DHM does this upgrade to our turbos it would get us to the 400whp... I emailed Russ (owner of DHM) and asked if I sent him a stock 2.7 turbo would he look at some possibilities of modifying it the same as his ST280 system, haven't heard back yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Halstead Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 I am curious to see what is coming as there is not very much demand for performance stuff like there are for SHO's and Fusion Sports. Fusion Sport has no support either, unless you count Steeda and there sorry attempt of an intake for $350. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWPerfA_ZN0W Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 No harm in talking to Mike anyway. He had his 3.5EB Flex at 600+ AWHP with fuel system upgrade + tuning. Your call, of course. Having an upgraded HPFP would be great 4 sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Heath Jr Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 Fusion Sport has no support either, unless you count Steeda and there sorry attempt of an intake for $350. Have you seen the intake yet? I looked on Steeda's site, nothing for the 2.7 in the Fusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjb89 Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 Have you seen the intake yet? I looked on Steeda's site, nothing for the 2.7 in the Fusion. They probably took it down because it was such a joke.. Over priced POS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Halstead Posted March 2, 2017 Report Share Posted March 2, 2017 Have you seen the intake yet? I looked on Steeda's site, nothing for the 2.7 in the Fusion. I dunno where you are looking https://www.steeda.com/fusion/steeda-fusion-twin-turbo-cold-air-kit/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Heath Jr Posted March 3, 2017 Report Share Posted March 3, 2017 I dunno where you are looking https://www.steeda.com/fusion/steeda-fusion-twin-turbo-cold-air-kit/ Yep, completely missed that! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted March 5, 2017 Report Share Posted March 5, 2017 (edited) The problem with tuning for E85 is that it is not a consistent octane or concentration as that varies from season to season. E85 is going to be around E70 during the winter months which means it will likely be lower octane. As a result, I suspect E85 tunes probably put in a fair margin of safety. Going to E85 pretty much guarantees that you will need to upgrade the fuel pumps, injectors, and O2 sensors to make it work right. For GTDI engines like ours, that means a LOT of money but then again you have to pay to play and having that kind of octane to work with means massive performance gains so long as you don't plan on driving into the many parts of the country that have little or no E85 availability. Edited March 5, 2017 by junehhan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustys318 Posted March 5, 2017 Report Share Posted March 5, 2017 E70 is still 101+ octane, still good but I see your point. Ford has done the port and DI for the latest gen 3.5, I'm sure to help clean up coking valves and cold starting efficiency. But the dual fueling delivery capability for a pro-tuner could tune in an easy 400whp/500tq (up from 375/470 stock). If and when Ford does the port/DI combo for the 2.7 I think we could push some serious boost (why would Ford go CGI in gas as they do diesel if they aren't planning to do same?) to them. I bought a couple of "take off" turbos from a wrecked Sport (NOTE: F150 turbos are different), going to wait to see if Puma (x-47), Cyborg (C39) or DHM (ST280) will come out with a hybrid wheel for us, if/when they do I will send these two to them for upgrading. I still haven't heard back from Russ (DHM) about wanting to take on the project but I know the Fusion Sport guys will be pushing for some upgrades so I just want my "cores" ready. Ford is doing the port/DI combo to their new 1.5T three cylinder and is getting the same power (with an even lighter engine) as they did with the 1.6T four so it's safe to say that they will continue to develop big power out of smaller displacement engines. Hell the current F150 2.7's make the same power my old 2010 F150 5.4 made! Done some "eye balling" measurements with my buds Focus ST intercooler and it looks like a good starting point for development especially since the ST FMIC has the MAP sensor on the intercooler as we do ours. It looks like we'd have to take off the shudder system like we did on his Focus ST. I wasn't ready to take off the bumper for better visuals just yet, got a busy day ahead of me... when I do it I will post pictures, probably start a new FMIC thread with the pictures... http://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/feu/en/news/2017/02/24/next-gen-ford-fiesta-st-debuts-200-ps--3-cylinder--1-5-litre-eco.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted March 5, 2017 Report Share Posted March 5, 2017 Ford actually has stated several times that their adaption of dual fuel injection is for emissions purposes. Dual fuel injection is expensive but has been agreed upon by many industry analysts as being needed to meet the next level of emissions requirements. Ford has stated that they chose to go with CGI for part of the 2.7's block in order to save weight while keeping things durable. Ford chose to use CGI in the parts of the block most stressed while utilizing aluminum for everything else. By utilizing this material, they were able to achieve the strength needed with less material thickness as they might have needed if they chose to go with full aluminum. That makes sense considering that Ford was intent on making the 2.7 their volume leader engine for truck duty. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustys318 Posted March 6, 2017 Report Share Posted March 6, 2017 Nick, you said "Upgrading the turbo's is going to be fun. Since they are mated to the block and the front turbo has ZERO room for a bigger one." You are correct with that statement if you are changing the turbo system to a larger frame turbo. The thing I'm going to do is like what I did to my Fiesta ST, same frame but different wheel, the "hybrid". You take off your factory turbo, send it to one of the big three (DHM, Puma or Cyborg) and let them do the milling/modifying and you bolt it right back on. It's why I bought a couple of "take offs" from a wrecked/damaged engine Edge Sport, so I'll have my "cores" ready when the big three offer the hybrid upgrade. And hopefully some downpipes would have been developed too.. and fuel pump upgrade.. and intercooler.. and 4 Bar MAP... It's a sickness, and I has it... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 It is a sickness for sure. I have been curious to see how far the Edge platform can be taken without compromising daily drivability. I didn't even know you could do that to the stock turbo housing, but wouldn't that negatively affect long term durability? Those things cycle between extreme heat conditions continuously. I am still waiting to see who has the first 12 second Edge Sport. Leo is close with his run at 13.2 on race fuel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Halstead Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Nick, you said "Upgrading the turbo's is going to be fun. Since they are mated to the block and the front turbo has ZERO room for a bigger one." You are correct with that statement if you are changing the turbo system to a larger frame turbo. The thing I'm going to do is like what I did to my Fiesta ST, same frame but different wheel, the "hybrid". You take off your factory turbo, send it to one of the big three (DHM, Puma or Cyborg) and let them do the milling/modifying and you bolt it right back on. It's why I bought a couple of "take offs" from a wrecked/damaged engine Edge Sport, so I'll have my "cores" ready when the big three offer the hybrid upgrade. And hopefully some downpipes would have been developed too.. and fuel pump upgrade.. and intercooler.. and 4 Bar MAP... It's a sickness, and I has it... yeah I have it too, but the wife and my child actor in the making take all my moneys...lol. gotta add rebalancing the turbo after the upgrade too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustys318 Posted March 8, 2017 Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 This is for the Fiesta ST but it's an example of what they can do to the stock small frame turbo... (might have to copy and paste into your browser) http://www.pumaspeed.co.uk/product-Fiesta-ST180-X-47-340-Billet-7-Blade-Hybrid-Turbocharger_17318.jsp http://deadhookmotorsports.com/Fiesta-ST/Fiesta-ST-Turbo-Upgrade/DHM-ST280-Fiesta-Turbo-Package http://wn.com/cyborg39_fiesta_st_turbocharger 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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