Synthetic or not Synthetic---Tis the question

[ochness]

It is alomost time for my first oil change and I am trying to decide whether to start using synthetic oil, non synthetic, or a blend. I think some people in the forums have mentioned that they use the Race Craft blend so that maybe a good choice.

 

If I choose synthetic do I possiable face any warranty issues? Any suggestions on which synthetic to use? I have a friend that has run Amsoil (sp) in a number of race cars he has had and seems to like that brand.

 

Anyway, any insite on this would be great.

[akirby]

It is alomost time for my first oil change and I am trying to decide whether to start using synthetic oil, non synthetic, or a blend. I think some people in the forums have mentioned that they use the Race Craft blend so that maybe a good choice.

 

If I choose synthetic do I possiable face any warranty issues? Any suggestions on which synthetic to use? I have a friend that has run Amsoil (sp) in a number of race cars he has had and seems to like that brand.

 

Anyway, any insite on this would be great.

 

The factory motorcraft 5W-20 is a synthetic blend - no real reason to use anything else during the warranty period.

[ochness]

Thank you for your advise. I think for now the Motorcraft is what I will use.

[solas989]

The factory motorcraft 5W-20 is a synthetic blend - no real reason to use anything else during the warranty period.

 

 

Make note he said blend - synthetic and conventional mix.

 

As for me, I use 100% synthetic. In fact I use Amsoil EP (7500 miles).

 

No, Ford can not deny you warranty work because you use full synthetic. However, they "could" if you move to 0w20 or 10w20. Note I said could.

 

Now all this said - what is your expected life for the Edge? The benefit of synthetics is its protection and life. I will change oil every 7500 miles and want the extra piece of mind using synthetics. Once out of warranty I will move to long life Amsoil and change about every 20K miles with 3 or 4 filter changes in the middle.

 

If you expect to get rid of your Edge in 5 years or less, stick with the Ford Oil (or similiar). If you are like me and expect it to last a minimum of 8 years, use synthetic. Note, even using the Ford oil will work but wont last the 20K miles - but I like the extra protection and life of the oil.

 

I get good deals on Amsoil (~$5 per qt shipped) through family.

 

Is it required - not really - the Ford Motor Oil is good stuff accoding to many.

 

It all depends on how anal you are in your protection.

 

See other posts here too

 

Solas

[druck52]

Every one here seems to have a different opion on oil and change interval. I know ford says 7500 miles. but i change mine every 3000 and use motorcraft oil and oil filter(I work at a ford dealership, so i have easy access to the ford product). My personal opion though is that as long as you us oil that meets fords standards and change it at regular intervals you should be fine.

[beasley21800]

Every one here seems to have a different opion on oil and change interval. I know ford says 7500 miles. but i change mine every 3000 and use motorcraft oil and oil filter(I work at a ford dealership, so i have easy access to the ford product). My personal opion though is that as long as you us oil that meets fords standards and change it at regular intervals you should be fine.

I still use the old 3 months or 3000 mile standard. We do alot of start and stop and drive in stop and go traffic. I use what ever the Ford dealer puts in the car. Not worth changing myself for $25.99. I would have to work on my back in my driveway in the cold or in the heat. Not for me anymore. That was fine when i was 19 making $6.00 an hour.

 

Wow $5 bucks a quart! That's $25 for a simple oil change for the oil alone. Do you really think that the oil is that much better for engine? My '00 Honda CR-V is 7 1/2 years old and it uses whatever the honda dealer puts in and has never had any engine issues. Same thing with my 99 Pontiac Grand AM had that car 10 years and no engine issues only mufflers and alternators.

[solas989]

Yes, $25 for my peace of mind it is worth it. Oil refining and processing has come a long ways since the good ol days (I am NOT making a jab here). Most oil brands take longer to break down than before and offer more protection along the way.

 

I change (will change) every 7500 miles per the warranty - this oil does not break down in that time (per my Mazda and other lab reports from various conditions). I also do stop n go as well as highway (which alot of the time IS stop n go).

 

Lets do the math for the number of oil changes for 15000 miles. I assume your price has the oil filter. My oil filter is Mobil1 10.68 locally.

 

At 3000 miles:

3000 25.99

6000 25.99

9000 25.99

12000 25.99

15000 25.99

 

Total $129.95

 

 

At 7500 Miles (In warranty and my particular brand is Amsoil - I would think the Ford would NOT break down at 7500 miles either)

 

$27.78 for the oil 5.5 qts (bought in cases though) - does the edge have 5 or 5.5 qts - i forget - did only 1 oil change. Lets assume it is 5.5.

$10.68 for filter.

$0.00 for labor - will always do it myself - have a heated garage which helps

$0.00 for disposal

 

7500 35.93

7500 35.93

 

Total $79.91.

 

 

That is a large difference imo. NOTE: this is my opinion and only MY practices. If your peace of mind comes at 3000 miles that is your benefit. In the end, it is your car not mine.

 

I will have even more savings when I am out of warranty - usually two years with the amount of miles we put on vehicles. I will switch to the longer life Amsoil oil 25K miles and do changes every 20K miles. I have seen the lab reports in person and know the drivers. It does not break down.

 

For reference, i need this car to last 8 years (or 192K miles) to recoup the costs. Any extra protection I get the better.

 

Just my $0.01 and you can toss that into a well if you need.

 

Solas

[beasley21800]

Yes, $25 for my peace of mind it is worth it. Oil refining and processing has come a long ways since the good ol days (I am NOT making a jab here). Most oil brands take longer to break down than before and offer more protection along the way.

 

I change (will change) every 7500 miles per the warranty - this oil does not break down in that time (per my Mazda and other lab reports from various conditions). I also do stop n go as well as highway (which alot of the time IS stop n go).

 

Lets do the math for the number of oil changes for 15000 miles. I assume your price has the oil filter. My oil filter is Mobil1 10.68 locally.

 

At 3000 miles:

3000 25.99

6000 25.99

9000 25.99

12000 25.99

15000 25.99

 

Total $129.95

 

 

At 7500 Miles (In warranty and my particular brand is Amsoil - I would think the Ford would NOT break down at 7500 miles either)

 

$27.78 for the oil 5.5 qts (bought in cases though) - does the edge have 5 or 5.5 qts - i forget - did only 1 oil change. Lets assume it is 5.5.

$10.68 for filter.

$0.00 for labor - will always do it myself - have a heated garage which helps

$0.00 for disposal

 

7500 35.93

7500 35.93

 

Total $79.91.

 

 

That is a large difference imo. NOTE: this is my opinion and only MY practices. If your peace of mind comes at 3000 miles that is your benefit. In the end, it is your car not mine.

 

I will have even more savings when I am out of warranty - usually two years with the amount of miles we put on vehicles. I will switch to the longer life Amsoil oil 25K miles and do changes every 20K miles. I have seen the lab reports in person and know the drivers. It does not break down.

 

For reference, i need this car to last 8 years (or 192K miles) to recoup the costs. Any extra protection I get the better.

 

Just my $0.01 and you can toss that into a well if you need.

 

Solas

i see your point and it is a good one. I guess it's my father in the back of my head saying to me "oil has to be changed every 3000 miles". Childhood memories we all have them. Although, if i were to change to the the ford schedule the price does become less.

 

I am not trying to start an arguement please don't take it that way. You also need to factor in your time, unless you enjoy working on cars. Than it's a hobby and that's great. Some tell me i am crazy because i wax my car every week (April - October), only have been able to do it 3 times the winter, but i enjoy doing it.

 

I am luckey my wife works as a warranty admistrator for a ford dealer so the car is serviced while she is working so no time issues for me going to the dealer and we only get charged for the filter. Parts are at cost and no labor charges. The $25.99 is for regular customers. I think the filter cost us about $7.50 plus tax.

 

I guess there is no price for piece of mind.

 

beasley21800

[solas989]

I agree - no price for peace of mind. I understand where you come from - it took me a long time with lots of hard evidence to convince me too. I dont think you are arguing - however, I just like to babble.

 

I am glad to see some people are "weird" about washing/waxing cars too. In the winter, I always wish I had installed a hose outlet in my garage. I have my whole regiment from claying to glazing but it slows in the winter (no I have not clayed the edge yet since there is no need to). I really enjoy working on cars - maybe its because it gets me away from the wife...hmmm...hope she no read this.

 

I do my own oil changes, brakes (rotors and pads - I hate drums but thankfully they not on the edge), belts, tire rotations (not mounting), coolant etc. I am DREADING the spark plug change - ugggg. The front 3 will be easy, but not those back 3.

 

Solas

[GerRod]

I'm paying for a little more peace of mind as well. I'm going with full synthetic and changing the oil every 5,000 miles instead of 7,500. I'll go with either Mobil 1 or Royal Purple oil and probably the Motorcraft filter. I change the oil myself so I'll save a little there.

[DUCKRACER]

Yes, $25 for my peace of mind it is worth it. Oil refining and processing has come a long ways since the good ol days (I am NOT making a jab here). Most oil brands take longer to break down than before and offer more protection along the way.

 

I change (will change) every 7500 miles per the warranty - this oil does not break down in that time (per my Mazda and other lab reports from various conditions). I also do stop n go as well as highway (which alot of the time IS stop n go).

 

Lets do the math for the number of oil changes for 15000 miles. I assume your price has the oil filter. My oil filter is Mobil1 10.68 locally.

 

At 3000 miles:

3000 25.99

6000 25.99

9000 25.99

12000 25.99

15000 25.99

 

Total $129.95

 

 

At 7500 Miles (In warranty and my particular brand is Amsoil - I would think the Ford would NOT break down at 7500 miles either)

 

$27.78 for the oil 5.5 qts (bought in cases though) - does the edge have 5 or 5.5 qts - i forget - did only 1 oil change. Lets assume it is 5.5.

$10.68 for filter.

$0.00 for labor - will always do it myself - have a heated garage which helps

$0.00 for disposal

 

7500 35.93

7500 35.93

 

Total $79.91.

 

 

That is a large difference imo. NOTE: this is my opinion and only MY practices. If your peace of mind comes at 3000 miles that is your benefit. In the end, it is your car not mine.

 

I will have even more savings when I am out of warranty - usually two years with the amount of miles we put on vehicles. I will switch to the longer life Amsoil oil 25K miles and do changes every 20K miles. I have seen the lab reports in person and know the drivers. It does not break down.

 

For reference, i need this car to last 8 years (or 192K miles) to recoup the costs. Any extra protection I get the better.

 

Just my $0.01 and you can toss that into a well if you need.

 

Solas

I bet if you read the owners manual it will say something to the effect that 7500mi is ok under normal driving conditions and more often if you drive under "severe" conditions. Read further and I bet severe conditions include short trips or stop and go driving as wall as the usual towing and dusty conditions.

So in reality if you commute with your car, it is being driven under severe conditions and needs the oil changed a lot sooner that 7500k mi per the owners manual.

[bri719]

I'm paying for a little more peace of mind as well. I'm going with full synthetic and changing the oil every 5,000 miles instead of 7,500. I'll go with either Mobil 1 or Royal Purple oil and probably the Motorcraft filter. I change the oil myself so I'll save a little there.

 

 

ditto - with the exception I may or may not do it myself (definitely not on the first service). but everything else you said is same here.

[Grey]

A lot of "advisors" would have you believe that Ford could not deny warranty coverage if ypu have receipts, promises from a forum or oil supplier and/or good intentions. Not so!

 

Most lubrication issues are owner responsibility. You come in with ticking valve train, bearing failure, sludge, warped heads, etc. Ford will quickly determine how you (Corner Lube etc.) neglected proper maintenance (with correctly spec'd oils and filters.)

 

If peace of mind is so important to you, then take it back to your F/L/M dealership ahd have them do the maintenance. :shades:

Edited May 7, 2008 by Grey

[Jaak in TO]

There is one cost most forget. With Synthetic Oils one gets about 10% BETTER gas milage than with normal Dino Oil. Here is where the savings come in. It has less friction than dino which leads to better milege as well as a cooler engine. My Canadian Ford Dealer does sell and use Synthetic oils and have made that note in my file. I would prefer the extra protection year round; cooler in summer & easlier start-ups in the winter. Just follow the schedule in your manual for oil changes according to YOUR driving habits. Most come under the sever service catagory.

Edited May 8, 2008 by Jaak in TO

[akirby]

There is one cost most forget. With Synthetic Oils one gets about 10% BETTER gas milage than with normal Dino Oil. Here is where the savings come in. It has less friction than dino which leads to better milege as well as a cooler engine. My Canadian Ford Dealer does sell and use Synthetic oils and have made that note in my file. I would prefer the extra protection year round; cooler in summer & easlier start-ups in the winter. Just follow the schedule in your manual for oil changes according to YOUR driving habits. Most come under the sever service catagory.

 

That depends on the oil and the engine. Since Ford already uses a synthetic blend 5W-20 to save fuel I don't think you'd see more than a 1 or 2% increase for pure synthetic.

[iceman33]

As pointed out by many, it is up to you to decide what you want to do...Syntetic is definetely the winner here without a doubt. Yes, it is more expensive than conventional Oil, but it does offer better protection and benifits..

 

If one phrase could sum it up..."the Oil is the life of your Engine.." Up to you to decide..

[Grey]

If you are in an extremely cold environment, Motorcraft has a full synthetic oil in 5w20 and 5w30. It is recommended by Ford and meets all the Ford specifications. According to their website, it is designed for:

- Improved cold-temperature performance

- Lower volatility for reduced oil consumption

- Reduced engine wear

- Increased protection in severe operating conditions

- Formulated for fuel efficiency

 

But, don't put a full synthetic oil in your Edge/MKX for at least 3,000 miles. It is too slick and can prevent ring seating and glaze cylinder walls, leading to oil consumption and blow-by.

[Jaak in TO]

That depends on the oil and the engine. Since Ford already uses a synthetic blend 5W-20 to save fuel I don't think you'd see more than a 1 or 2% increase for pure synthetic.

Still it's an improvement overall. Savings on gasoline always helps!!!

[akirby]

Still it's an improvement overall. Savings on gasoline always helps!!!

 

You'll pay more for the full synthetic oil than you would ever gain back in fuel economy. So do it if it makes you feel better but don't justify it with non-existent cost savings.

[Jaak in TO]

2 to 5% or more savings over 8000 kms is not something to sneeze at.

[akirby]

2 to 5% or more savings over 8000 kms is not something to sneeze at.

 

But you won't get 2% to 5% by going from SEMI-synthetic motorcraft 5W-20 to FULL synthetic. I think you're being way too optimistic.

[Jaak in TO]

Been using synthetic for over 20 years. Once I changed over ... there was a noticable savings ... be it a used car or new. My 1986 Porsche 951 definatley sees a difference in milage.

[Grey]

Driving habits can affect MPG much more than oil. Do a search on Hyper Miler techniques and discover how to get 10-20% better fuel economy. :happy feet: :happy feet:

[Grey]

If you are in an extremely cold environment, Motorcraft has a full synthetic oil in 5w20 and 5w30. It is recommended by Ford and meets all the Ford specifications. According to their website, it is designed for:

- Improved cold-temperature performance

- Lower volatility for reduced oil consumption

- Reduced engine wear

- Increased protection in severe operating conditions

- Formulated for fuel efficiency

 

But, don't put a full synthetic oil in your Edge/MKX for at least 3,000 miles. It is too slick and can prevent ring seating and glaze cylinder walls, leading to oil consumption and blow-by.

 

 

Grey quotes himself as he just found a Canadian Government study of lubricants that includes the following:

 

"The Alberta Engine Oil Study - Lubricants Suitable for use in Southern & Central Alberta

 

Caution! We do not recommend the use of VHVI Synthetics during the 10,000-km new engine break-in period – reduced friction will certainly delay ring seating, or (worst) prevent ring seating from properly occurring (i.e. permanent tilted rings). "

 

They are even more cautious about not putting full sunthetics in an engine until the rings have seated ( as much as 10,000 km). That suggests more like 5,000 to 7,500 miles or the first regularly scheduled oil change.

 

So if you don't believe what the Ford engineers say, google the study for yourself.

[jpeckinp]

Grey quotes himself as he just found a Canadian Government study of lubricants that includes the following:

 

"The Alberta Engine Oil Study - Lubricants Suitable for use in Southern & Central Alberta

 

Caution! We do not recommend the use of VHVI Synthetics during the 10,000-km new engine break-in period – reduced friction will certainly delay ring seating, or (worst) prevent ring seating from properly occurring (i.e. permanent tilted rings). "

 

They are even more cautious about not putting full sunthetics in an engine until the rings have seated ( as much as 10,000 km). That suggests more like 5,000 to 7,500 miles or the first regularly scheduled oil change.

 

So if you don't believe what the Ford engineers say, google the study for yourself.

 

When did the Canadian Gov't become Ford engineers?

 

This is also from your article you quoted.

 

Mobil-1 exceeds the critical GM4718M Corvette Engine specification, re-engineered in 2002 to ensure GM product seal compatibility.

 

Warning! Like all other Synthetics, it will ultra-clean an engine; with the potential of creating seal leaks, and/or oil gallery blockage in older engines - therefore; we advise against using in vehicles with older than 5 years and/or 150,000 km - unless, of course, the engine has been previously using a synthetic motor oil.

 

Warning! And, like VHIV and PAO Synthetics, we do not recommend it for use during the initial 10,000-km new engine break-in period.

 

So if we want to go by what engineers say then GM is saying it is OK to use 100% Synthetic at mile 0 because they do just that in the Corvette. The people advising against it is the Canadian Gov't.

 

I tend to listen to the people that build and design the engine over some Gov't opinion.

Edited June 23, 2008 by jpeckinp