Sticking of turns of a tachometer when driving Ford EDGE AWD 2008

[EDST777]

Hi! Earlier I created topics that I made replacement of TSS and OSS, changed liquid ATF, PTU and RDU. I replaced spark plugs. I cleaned throtle when changed OSS. This preface.
Today I carried out a long trip of 90 kilometers, there was hot weather of 36 degrees Celsius. The trip came to the end when I was already in the city at a sharp set of speed turns of the engine hanged on a mark of 3000 revolutions per minute. I took away a leg from a pedal of the accelerometer (gas), but turns remained on the same level (they hanged). I within 10-20 seconds moved and pressed the accelerator pedal to try to bring the car out of a stupor. From the fifth attempt turns returned to normal (came unstuck). I already had such situation once. It occurs not often, but I would like to learn what it is connected with. It is an error of throtle or this jamming of the accelerator pedal (accelerometer) or it is electronics error? I have ODB a cord, but today I didn't watch a mistake, I will make it on Monday. But what your thoughts? I tried to state well to this problem in English. Thanks.

Edited August 13, 2016 by EDST777

[enigma-2]

Almost as if it was operating with the cruise control turned on?

 

Wonder what would happen if you were to tap the brake peddle next time this happens?

 

By the way, your English is very good, understood your meaning very well

Edited August 13, 2016 by enigma-2

[EDST777]

Almost as if it was operating with the cruise control turned on?

 

Wonder what would happen if you were to tap the brake peddle next time this happens?

 

By the way, your English is very good, understood your meaning very well

Thanks, precisely and approximately as on cruise control as though I hold one and same turns! With a brake.... yes I approximately and did now, I slightly pressed the accelerator pedal, then slightly braked, then again small pressing a pedal (short kicks on an accelerometer pedal) and from the fifth attempt turns have slowly returned to normal.

[enigma-2]

Think I would have the dealer check for codes. Could result in a dangerous situation. Hope it's not a big deal.

[EDST777]

Think I would have the dealer check for codes. Could result in a dangerous situation. Hope it's not a big deal.

 

I will make itself check, т.к I have a lace and the FORScan program, will perhaps make it tomorrow. But I wanted to know: there is nobody there was no such problem? - so far I prepare for check....

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Might be worth changing the Throttle Position Sensor on the throttle body, since you already tried cleaning the TB. If you can find some two stroke oil that meets the TC-W3 spec, try adding that 4 oz/tankful to the fuel (oil first, then fuel up). See if that helps. Made a difference on mine.

[EDST777]

Might be worth changing the Throttle Position Sensor on the throttle body, since you already tried cleaning the TB. If you can find some two stroke oil that meets the TC-W3 spec, try adding that 4 oz/tankful to the fuel (oil first, then fuel up). See if that helps. Made a difference on mine.

 

Thanks and I can find oil for two-stroke engines with the specified specification. I will make it. It will be greasing for prophylaxis? How it will influence system of injection of fuel? If the problem remains, further I will do replacement of the sensor of provision of a butterfly valve (throtle). I correctly understand your thought?

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Correct.

 

The oil is supposed to burn cleanly and lubricate engine parts/fuel system in two stroke engines. We are taking advantage of the lubrication properties when adding it to the fuel for the Edge. Should help fuel injectors work better over time. Does work when other products do not. May take a few tankfuls back to back for full effect. Remember that is 4 ounces per tank, not 4 ounces per gallon!!!

 

If that still does not help, definitely try replacing the TPS.

[EDST777]

Correct.

 

The oil is supposed to burn cleanly and lubricate engine parts/fuel system in two stroke engines. We are taking advantage of the lubrication properties when adding it to the fuel for the Edge. Should help fuel injectors work better over time. Does work when other products do not. May take a few tankfuls back to back for full effect. Remember that is 4 ounces per tank, not 4 ounces per gallon!!!

 

If that still does not help, definitely try replacing the TPS.

 

Thanks! I got it: four ounces on a full tank with fuel, - it is already possible to make several times in a row for the best effect.

P.s. It is interesting whether there is an opportunity to remove and check the TPS device - the voltmeter?

Edited August 14, 2016 by EDST777

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

With Forscan, you can track the TP1 PID, which shows you the TPS response to input. Technically speaking, the acceleration pedal position sensor is the first input to the PCM when you press the gas pedal. So you should track APP1, APP2, and APP3 also. Together they give you a better picture of the car's responsiveness to your inputs. Log the data and graph it. TP1 and APP1 should look similar; APP2 & APP3 should follow each other closely, and be the mirror image of APP1. Should look something like this:

 

 

Note that this graph is drawn from driving around data, but for a real test, you should provide as few variables as possible. So map out what data points you want to capture, then log them. For example, idle with no pedal input. Idle to 2000 rpm with steadily increasing input. Idle to 2000 rpm with a throttle snap. Hold at 2000 rpm for 10 seconds. That kind of thing. Then you get an idea of the responsiveness of the TP and APP sensors.

 

Unfortunately, on this generation of the Edge, we don't have a way to track injector performance individually through software, a digital voltmeter is required. Ecoboost engines you can.

[EDST777]

Thanks, is very important information, I very much appreciate it, I will try to do measurements tomorrow.

[EDST777]

If you can find some two stroke oil that meets the TC-W3 spec, try adding that 4 oz/tankful to the fuel (oil first, then fuel up).

 

The oil type matters: mineral or synthetic? For example MOTUL OUTBOARD 2T corresponds to TC-W3, but it is mineral. How you will advise? Thanks.

 

Today I did check of Forfscan, errors is not noticed. I have made measurements, according to the specified scheme, I attach images:1-without loading (just the engine idle running), 2-(gradual increase in turns till 2000 works), 3-intermittent increase (kicks) approximately to 2000,4 - deduction of turns for 2000 within 10-12 seconds.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2016 by EDST777

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

These tests were done from a cold start? If so, can you repeat them with a hot start, i.e., after the engine is warmed up? I dont normally rev the engine when its cold, but it's been like 90F mornings here lately, so an acceptable compromise I guess. I will check for myself in cold start conditions and post later.

 

If you have access to synthetic TC-W3, that is preferred, because the additive package will be better. Technically as along as the product meets the TC-W3 specifications, it should work. Maybe you can test to see the difference for yourself.

[EDST777]

Yes, it is valid, the first image has been made on cold start, the engine has not been heated-up yet. I will repeat it on heated-up.

Well, I understand, synthetic oil for 2T of TC-w3 will be more preferable. I have an access to it. Thanks!

[EDST777]

Hi. Now my repeated checks FORScan on the hot engine in the same sequence 1,2,3,4. So:

Edited August 16, 2016 by EDST777

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

There might be a very small possibility of an issue with a gradual input with the gas pedal. Snapping the gas pedal seems to have the expected response from the throttle. You could try taking the TPS off the throttle body, take a good look at the sensor AND the gears on the throttle body to see if there is any dirt/corrosion. Clean the sensor with electronic parts/MAF cleaner only. Let it dry out, reassemble and see if that makes a difference.

 

Did you have the hangup at 3000 rpm happen when the Edge was running well, before the issues with the TSS/OSS started? Did you disconnect the battery while you were working on the sensors? The engine was off when you cleaned the throttle body? Might just need to pull the negative battery cable for 30 minutes or more and let the PCM reset/relearn. There is a YT video on this, if you can access it:

 

If you DID disconnect the battery, and for long enough, how many KMs have you put on since then? The PCM relearn can take some time if you don't follow the drive cycle.

[EDST777]

Thanks, precisely to answer a question now: whether there was a problem with lag to problems with TSS/OSS to a smog. Problem of sensors has been found by me from the moment of purchase of Ford, in two months, I badly knew a problem and have been concentrated on it, studied a question therefore my supervision were indistinct and gave in to disorders.
As for replacement of OSS (which was recently, three weeks ago) that is valid, the rechargeable battery was not removed. I will try to make as you recommend (to remove accumulator supply for 30 minutes) and to look what there will be a result. Also I will watch purity of the MAF sensor. Thanks.

Edited August 16, 2016 by EDST777

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Ok. If you decide to clean the TPS, take before and after pics of the TPS and the mating throttle body gears. Cleaning the MAF sensor never hurts, but let's just do the battery thing for now. One thing at a time

[EDST777]

I have understood you, I will begin with the battery, this simplest. But how to check result, it will be necessary to make check of Forscan after disconnection of the battery how have made 1,2,3,4 earlier?

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

You have to give the PCM time to relearn. Depending on whether you can complete the drive cycle or not, the time it takes may be a bit more or less. I am not 100% sure, but you might see a P1000 code set while it relearns. That should clear after relearn is complete. Then is the time to get new data.

[EDST777]

Thanks, but the P1000 code is and now, I hoped that it is not an important mistake, it

says that the test isn't complete or complete not completely, but what test is definitely not specified. It means it can be dependent? Thanks.

Edited August 16, 2016 by EDST777

[EDST777]

You have to give the PCM time to relearn. Depending on whether you can complete the drive cycle or not, the time it takes may be a bit more or less. I am not 100% sure, but you might see a P1000 code set while it relearns. That should clear after relearn is complete. Then is the time to get new data.

Thanks, but the P1000 code is and now, I hoped that it is not an important mistake, it

says that the test isn't complete or complete not completely, but what test is definitely not specified. It means it can be dependent? Thanks.

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Usually it's some kind of emissions monitor that is setting the P1000 code. I would use Torque Pro to check the status, as they have a display just for that (very easy to check). Here is what the owner's manual says about the drive cycle:

 

Readiness for Inspection/Maintenance (I/M) testing
Some state/provincial and local governments may have
Inspection/Maintenance (I/M) programs to inspect the emission control
equipment on your vehicle. Failure to pass this inspection could prevent
you from getting a vehicle registration. Your vehicle may not pass the I/M
test if the Service engine soon indicator is on or not working
properly (bulb is burned out), or if the OBD-II system has determined
that some of the emission control systems have not been properly
checked. In this case, the vehicle is considered not ready for I/M testing.

 

If the Service engine soon indicator is on or the bulb does not
work, the vehicle may need to be serviced. Refer to the On board
diagnostics (OBD-II) description in this chapter.

 

If the vehicle’s engine or transmission has just been serviced, or the
battery has recently run down or been replaced, the OBD-II system may
indicate that the vehicle is not ready for I/M testing. To determine if the
vehicle is ready for I/M testing, turn the ignition key to the ON position
for 15 seconds without cranking the engine. If the Service engine
soon indicator blinks eight times, it means that the vehicle is not
ready for I/M testing; if the Service engine soon indicator stays on
solid, it means that the vehicle is ready for I/M testing.

 

The OBD-II system is designed to check the emission control system
during normal driving. A complete check may take several days. If the
vehicle is not ready for I/M testing, the following driving cycle consisting
of mixed city and highway driving may be performed:

 

15 minutes of steady driving on an expressway/highway followed by 20
minutes of stop-and-go driving with at least four 30-second idle periods.
Allow the vehicle to sit for at least eight hours without starting the
engine. Then, start the engine and complete the above driving cycle. The
engine must warm up to its normal operating temperature. Once started,
do not turn off the engine until the above driving cycle is complete. If
the vehicle is still not ready for I/M testing, the above driving cycle will
have to be repeated.

 

2010 Edge Description of On Board Diagnostic Drive cycle.pdf

Edited August 16, 2016 by WWWPerfA_ZN0W

[EDST777]

Hi, I have made calibration of a throttle, have disconnected to Clem "+ " for 30 minutes and in additives I have connected it with "-." I have made everything as it is specified in video, further I have tried to finish the full cycle I/M as you it is specified in the manul (15 minutes on highway, 20 minutes and four stops for 30 seconds, then eight hours of a stop, then to warm up the engine and to finish a cycle). I have made it, but the lamp blinks eight times it means that I/M is not complete, but I will try to do it once again as it is specified in a manual. Today I have made oscillogram FORScan to compare with pregoing, here that I have received:

 

 

 

 

I am disturbed also, what you specified earlier: it is late reaction of a throttle to pressing of a pedal.Sometimes : I want to tell that when driving, I also notice this shortcoming when I go slowly 45-50 km/h and I need to make fast acceleration till 80-90 km/h, I sharply press an accelerometer pedal - the car thinks 2-3 seconds and does breakthrough. All have this problem?

Edited August 18, 2016 by EDST777

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Some of it is the stock tune the Edge comes with. A] fuel economy, and B] saves the transmission also. But it should be more like a half second delay or thereabouts.

 

The graphs were made with engine warmed up? They still have me leaning towards a throttle body issue. Have you checked that the electrical connector is seated properly? You will have to also look carefully to see if there is dirt/corrosion in the connectors. I would definitely pull off the throttle body, remove the TPS, and check to make sure the gears on the throttle body side are not damaged, and that there is no carbon tracking or damage to the TPS side. If there are no obvious issues, I would order and replace the TPS anyway.

 

Are you monitoring fuel trims, O2s, catalytic converter temperatures, and EVAP performance? At a minimum, I'd log those parameters, along with RPM, speed, etc.