Considering Edge...

[kmarnes]

I've been waiting to order the redesigned 2018 Audi SQ5 -- which is a totally different car than the edge. Not trying to compare these cars at all. I've been on a waiting list for over a year and it still hasn't been announced though anticipating October at the Paris auto show.

 

I live in Canada, and historically Costco doesn't have auto deals like they do in the US... but the current one is enticing enough for me to check things out. So a decked out Edge costs about $49,000 CDN after the discounts ($5050 Employee price discount, less another $1000 for Costco) -- so $49k is about 11% off MSRP. But to further entice me, I can finance it for 48 months for 0% interest. Pretty much unheard of.

 

Ironically if I could get the Explorer with only 5 seats, I'd lean towards that, though the finance rates are 3.9%. I just feel the extra seats aren't needed. My wife would be happy if I went for a larger car like an Explorer or an Edge. Our other car is a Honda CRV. Lovely car, quite happy with it. Cargo space could be bigger.

 

Compared to a new Audi, I was able to secure a small discount off MSRP -- these luxury cars usually have waiting lists at full MSRP. And finance rates are likely to be 3.9-4.4%, and I'd have to stretch out the loan so the payments aren't too extreme. The new generation of Audi's have very fuel efficient engines and virtual cockpits, which are very cool. (Q7, A4, TT)

 

Being new to Ford shopping, it seems the Employee Pricing discounts are significant, and probably annual. It seems there is a redesign coming. Does the 2017 have a digital dashboard? I saw a screenshot, but was hard to tell.

 

Anyways, I still have to weigh a $50k Edge vs a $70k Audi. I considered the F-Pace as well, but damn... $80k+taxes. Ironically probably the same size as the Edge. F-Pace is midpoint between X3 and X5 (or Q5 and Q7).

 

I'll be test driving and Edge vs Explorer side-by-side this week with an open mind.

 

My overall general concerns with Fords as a brand is faster depreciation, lower reliability, and inferior fuel economy. Kind of fits the bill with other American car companies too. My experience with Japanese brands (mostly Honda) has been that of very high reliability, fuel economy, and resale... but boring colors and weaker engines. German brands are more expensive but have good luxury and performance, and expensive maintenance, but fun. I realize it's very generalistic. I did have fun owning a 2006 Jeep Commander with a 5.7 Hemi engine for a couple years. Got a whopping 9 MPG. Giant, heavy beast of a car.

 

 

So specific questions:

1. Should I wait for redesigns? Are digital dashboards incoming? High value for me.
2. What's it like negotiating for Ford in Canada outside of the Employee Pricing window, especially if you are waiting for a new design to release? Do they have waiting lists and charge full price due to higher demand? I can't imagine it would be as harsh as trying to land in a new Jaguar F-Pace for example.

[oleg6662]

Just ordered 2016 EDGE TITANIUM. All i can say, i did negotiate lower than employee pricing by about 800 in Toronto. Just had to go to 2 different dealers and tell them what is my price and got it from second one.

[kmarnes]

So did not like Edge. I will explain in a new post called Ford vs Audi.

[akirby]

Why aren't you comparing the MKX to the Audi? Much closer in price and features.

[kmarnes]

Because Lincoln's are hideous looking. The front grills look like cat-fish whiskers. They really need to design that away. I was specifically checking out Fords because of the price deals going on right now.

 

Alright, so just finished my detailed comparison. I think it's legit. http://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/20920-ford-vs-audi-edgeexplorerf-150-vs-q5q7/

[akirby]

Maybe you're thinking about the previous gen. This is what the new ones look like:

 

[kmarnes]

Yes, catfish whiskers still there.

 

Although I just priced one one online and they are also part of the Ford Employee pricing, which is cool! Even with the pricing they are similar prices to Audis -- and I agree they are more directly comparable. But the aesthetics (inside and out) of the Lincolns are the ugliest of any car brand. I'm sure some will disagree, but I believe many people feel the same way as I do on that.

 

It kind of feels like the MSRP on Fords/Lincolns are inflated to make the Ford Employee pricing look more attractive. While $55k for an Explorer compares to an $80k Audi Q7, and I can actually really consider the price difference for what I'm getting... I would go for the Explorer.

But going down to the Edge ($50k) vs Q5 3.0 ($60k) vs MKX ($60k), the Audi wins.

Edited July 28, 2016 by kmarnes

[akirby]

Ok - just wanted to make sure you had seen the new one. To each his own.

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

I do like Audi's styling cues, have for years.

[akirby]

I like Audis the best out of the German brands (not counting Porsche). We sat in the Q3, Q5 and Q7 at the auto show and didn't really like the interior as much as the MKX. Then again we're long time Ford fans so not surprising.

[enigma-2]

Audi is not without's faults. Big ones too. Best way is to read through a forum with a "what's wrong with Audi" topic.

http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/index.php?threads/104715/

[PaulSchott]

Not getting involved with the Lincoln vs. Audi thing, I do deed to comment on the Lincoln grill. What were they thinking!! I hope they incorporate the new continental grill into the MKX the next go around. Very Jaguarish

[Mirage52]

My wife has a VW Eos...Q3 has same engine. Service and maintenance on the EOS is similar to a Benz. We're due for another DSG transmission fluid change, and last time it cost us around $600. So keep that in mind with Audi.

 

Ford is still very easy to do some work yourself on. I don't even bother to try to change the oil on my wife's car. Too complicated.

Edited October 28, 2016 by Mirage52

[dshamer]

My 2009 garage kept Lincoln mkx, with 27,000 pampered miles needs trailing arms and bearings. Considering that ford has never addressed this issue along with the defective design of the PTU, I'd go with anything but a Ford product. Defective designed pieces of junk! Proof is in the pudding...My first and last Ford product.

[kmarnes]

Wow, old abandoned thread of mine. A lot happened since I wrote this.

 

I bought a 2017 Ford Explorer Sport, have had it for 3 months now and loving it. It came down to $60k for the Explorer vs $90k for the Audi (out the door after fees and taxes for both -- in BC Canada). I was able to dodge luxury tax by getting the Ford and financed it over 4 years for 1.9%. Haven't encountered any problems. Paid $2.9k to get a 10 year extended warranty, so I have my piece of mind too.

 

The Audi was really nice, but just stupid expensive. Couldn't justify it.

[dshamer]

Understood. That was money well spent.( for the 10 yr warranty) Chances are you will get your money's worth since you bought a Ford product. It's a shame that you have to spend $2.9k for peace of mind for something you just spent $60k for.

 

I love my Lincoln when it's not shitting on me. It's like a dog that's not house trained. Love hate relationship. But, I'm thinking about taking this dog to the pound.

[kmarnes]

Sometimes you just might end up with a lemon, and sometimes it's a common problem with a particular model year. Pretty much happens to all manufacturers. I once had a 2001 BMW 325i (awesome car for the time), but that thing lived in the shop half the time with the most annoying problems. But those were solid cars. I just got a bad one somehow. I ditched it and moved on.

 

But I despise Lincolns every which way. I find them to be ugly, overpriced Fords. For their price point, I would go German every time. To me, they don't even compare.

 

EDIT: Sorry -- I actually don't mean to be viciously mean about this. In my brain, I literally do not understand why anyone would purchase a Lincoln. I'd love to hear why some people do. For me, it's more about my dislike about aesthetics than anything else.

Edited November 17, 2016 by kmarnes

[akirby]

Sometimes you just might end up with a lemon, and sometimes it's a common problem with a particular model year. Pretty much happens to all manufacturers. I once had a 2001 BMW 325i (awesome car for the time), but that thing lived in the shop half the time with the most annoying problems. But those were solid cars. I just got a bad one somehow. I ditched it and moved on.

 

But I despise Lincolns every which way. I find them to be ugly, overpriced Fords. For their price point, I would go German every time. To me, they don't even compare.

 

EDIT: Sorry -- I actually don't mean to be viciously mean about this. In my brain, I literally do not understand why anyone would purchase a Lincoln. I'd love to hear why some people do. For me, it's more aesthetics than anything else.

 

You can't go German at the same price point and get the same size vehicle with the same features.

 

Some of us actually like the Lincoln styling. The 2016+ MKX is noticeably quieter and more comfortable than the Edge with a lot of additional features.

[akirby]

Also - while Edge and MkX have had more than their fair share of problems the last few years, they're not all bad.

 

Our 2008 Edge lasted 6 years and the only repair/problem was $100 cooling fan that I replaced myself in 30 minutes.

[enigma-2]

My 2009 garage kept Lincoln mkx, with 27,000 pampered miles needs trailing arms and bearings. Considering that ford has never addressed this issue along with the defective design of the PTU, I'd go with anything but a Ford product. Defective designed pieces of junk! Proof is in the pudding...My first and last Ford product.

Well, my garage kept, 2009 Lincoln MKX, with 100k mIles has no problems with its trailing arms or bearings. Maybe it's how you drive. Potholes and road hazards car quickly take their toll on a cars suspension. My wife's 04 Sebring Convertible goes through bearings. Third set so far. (And of course the water pump issue and all the known problems with Sebrings. Costs money to keeo a car in good condition.)

 

Ive never had a problem with my PTU either. What kind of problems are you having with yours? Sorry to hear that, they are expensive if they fail.)

 

Personally I find the 09 MKX to be the best car I've ever owned. And I like to keep it as close to showroom as possible, more fun to drive that way. Although it's only my opinion, I feel it's actually a better design than many of the later models (although I have to admit that the 2016's feature that shows a top-down view of all the space surrounding the car, is brilliant. I have to actually turn my head and look in the mirrors to see what's around me when I'm driving. Sync 3 isn't a must have however. Just my opinion.)

 

But back to your car, are you planning on replacing the bearings? Wouldn't want those to fail on a long trip away from home.

 

Never heard of the trailing arms failing. Are you talking about the rubber bushings getting old and worn? At 27k I would get a second opinion. Just doesn't sound right. That just not a part that fails, even if you hit road hazards. Even so, bushings aren't expensive.

 

Sorry you are not happy with your 09 MKX. I really love mine.

Edited November 17, 2016 by enigma-2

[autom8r]

184,000 Miles. Virtually no issues.

 

Normal maintenance items, Plugs 2x, Coils 1x, two sets of tires, 1 set of brakes. Engine mount, brake booster, cooling fan assembly, battery 1x (now OPTIMA), a door lock actuator. Full synthetic oil changes every 5k miles, air filter every 15k. Except for the tires, I self performed all these repairs which were easy and straight forward.

 

I installed all the accessories, and they shouldn't be part of the reliability equation, but the accessories, some OEM, most not, are reliable too. Even the HR springs are seasoned now and ride very well.

 

If you look at my signature, I've owned a lot of German cars. My neighbors thought I suffered a stroke when I brought the Ford home, and I bought it USED with 91k on the odometer! I bought it for next to nothing and it was in excellent condition so I couldn't resist.

 

I've driven it over 90k miles now, thought I'd send it to college with my son and get another Autobahn terror; now I'm really curious how long the car will last. I sent him off in his BMW.

 

I love the German hardware, but nothing German I've ever owned has been as reliable as the Edge. The car is a tank, built very well, starts every time and has never, since I've owned it, been in the shop. Parts are readily available everywhere and inexpensive compared to the German parts and any amateur Sunday mechanic can work on it without special tooling or electronics.

 

My 2 cents. I applaud Ford for this one.

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

On a side note, macbwt is almost caught up to your Edge with his 2011 (currently at 167K)

[dshamer]

I despise manufactures don't stand behind their products.

[dshamer]

From what I've read it's recommended to replace the trailing arm when the bearing goes. If it was just a bearing I wouldn't be as pissed. The combination is expensive.

 

My point is that a 27,000 mile garaged kept vehicle, adult driven, (NO BAD ROADS) should not need this kind of service. And this repair with low milage is not unusual for the MKX/ Edge.

 

I find it amusing that folks want to blame the owner for defective products just because their vehicle was the exception rather than the norm. And, some how justify the repairs by comparing same to expensive euro cars and their problems?

 

Some things just boggle the mind...

[akirby]

It's called being objective and realistic. The bearings can fail early but it's not a widespread problem and it's not the end of the world.