jpark Posted February 12, 2008 Report Share Posted February 12, 2008 Jpark - haven't forgotten about you, i contacted the manufacturer today, and they said that they would be getting info over to me, but the person who handles the technical side, was not available at the time of the call. If i dont hear anything back today, i'll get back in touch with them tommorow. Chad Thanks. Again, I wasn't trying to be confrontational, and I appreciate the info! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Talionis Posted February 12, 2008 Report Share Posted February 12, 2008 (edited) Also, I want to make it very clear that the Edge uses solid-state devices to drive the factory low-beams. I'm not as concerned with claims about your ballast's reliability as I am with your ballast's ability to operate without harming my Edge's driver circuits. The Edge's low-beams outputs are PWM 12V, which means PULSED, even on full (non-DRL) brightness. Damage to the low-beam drivers means that the entire Smart Junction Box would have to be replaced Okay... you posted this theory in 2 places, but I am going to just address it here as it is the hot place at the moment. I posted your theory and provided information on a BIG HID thread managed by a pretty reputable company - from what I can tell - and here is the first response I got back. None of this is my response nor, as we know, is it my theory... I just edited down what you asked and posted it there as I find it an interesting concern that needs addressing. I hope people find it useful and helpful - I know I am. Is this theory or did someone actually blow the FET on their board? The reason I ask is because if someone managed to blow a FET on the board it is only because there is no overload or short-circuit protection on the boards either, kind of a dumb thing to do by the circuit designer on an automative application. Could and would are two very different things. Using a harness to alleviate all load from the OE harness and controls would remedy that, and we have those available. The pulse width modulation in the same sense may screw with the relay on the harness as well, depends on the wave form used (square vs. sigmoid) and the frequency. The only way to know for sure is by trying it out. The other thing to do is find if the PWM cicuit is before or after the controls in the cabin based on a wiring diagram. If it is after, you may be able to bypass all that. Shoot me an email about this directly. I will shoot him an email as requested and see what more, from a company that sells tons of these, installs them, and seems to have a solid reputation in using digital ballast HID kits, and report back what I find. UPDATE: here is the follow up email I got: The harness does not really protect the junction box, it simply removes it from supplying the ballasts with power. Instead the OE low beam signal powers a coil in a relay to close the cicuit directly from battery to the ballasts. the question is since the relay is an electro-magnetic device, is if the PWM will keep it closed constantly or if it will result in an open/closed/open/closed type of thing. It is not unique to your vehicle, but ever vehicle's control is different, on VW it requires a standard 6800uF cap and on Saab for example it requires loss of the fog lights through reprogramming the car computer at a dealership. I'd just try it out with the harness and see how it goes. I guess this begs the questions... kind of risky to just 'try it out and see how it goes'. if it goes bad, the HID kit will not be your worry. and if it seems it goes bad, you will not find out until the junction box dies.... assuming this is even a real issue to be concerned about. I posted him a follow up email and will post if he adds anything of value. UPDATE 2: I responded and simply asked him "Based on what you know, see, experience, industry knowledge... Are you concerned about what I raised or me using these?" No, with the relay harness (an additional item about $10) it relieves all the danger from over current in the "junction box." Even if you did not use the extra relay harness, that circuit is a ticking time bomb on a motor vehicle if over-current and short-circuit protection are not built in. In the very least there is a fuse to potect that system! Once again, this is something someone seems to have not fully understood as there is no solid proof to back up the theory, and apparently the theory does not take into account correct automotive electronics are designed. Automotive electrical systems are extremely "noisy" by their very nature, they are prone to current and voltage swings, frequency interference, etc. Once again, by using the relay harness, there will be a reduction in the load that "junction box" will see versus the draw your stock bulbs use. The harness draws power directly from the battery, not the OE junction box and harness. UPDATE 3: when I asked "so, I should be getting this relay harness then to be safe?" yes, you can not do it without it, the ballasts will not work in a PWM state. The only reason I surmise that you need a relay is that you mention PWM, most cars don't have this, very rare actually. But If others are using digital kits without a ballast flickering or dim HID output and no relay, then you should be able to do the same, however given what you have told me - about PWM concern - it does not seem as that should be the case. Like I said before, the control circuit there has to internally protected from any dangers the ballasts would cause by requiring more current on start-up. Edited February 13, 2008 by Lex Talionis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 13, 2008 Report Share Posted February 13, 2008 Got my kit in the mail today. As soon as it gets above 60 degrees and the butt load of snow is gone I will try and get it installed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2008 Got my kit in the mail today.As soon as it gets above 60 degrees and the butt load of snow is gone I will try and get it installed. Glad to hear you got it. if its anything like it is here, it wont be 60 for a while! lol. If you were closer, i'd install it for you, only takes about 10 -15 minutes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INTERAVE Posted February 14, 2008 Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 I agree. I am not going to just take someones word that he has better HID lights and then just fork over $200 bucks and sit and hope that I actually get the darn things. I need to see an actual website then I need to verify that the seller is a true seller with a good product and reputation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solas989 Posted February 14, 2008 Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 I know I am a wee bit out of my realm in technical specs in regards to the edge (and if Oracle works correctly or not) BUT I know Oracle is a good company and my Brother In Law LOVES them on his IS350 (check out clublexus.com) and see what people have to say about Oracle. He has replaced both the FOG and LOW in his ride. Just my $0.01 Solas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 I agree. I am not going to just take someones word that he has better HID lights and then just fork over $200 bucks and sit and hope that I actually get the darn things. I need to see an actual website then I need to verify that the seller is a true seller with a good product and reputation. Interave - i've been doing business on this site for around 3 or 4 months now, but if you want to check in on me and my products, while my website is still under development, check out www.dodgetalk.com , www.dakotausa.com, or www.g6performance.com. I have been a sponsor on those sites for a few years now. There are a lot of happy customers on those sites, and i'm sure if you would ask, anyone would recommend me. However, i can understand your doubts, so if you'd feel more comfortable, shoot me a PM asking for my phone number, and i'll get it over to you. Chad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 15, 2008 Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 Chad, I noticed one thing with my kit. You mentioned that it has a lifetime warranty on the ballast and bulbs, but the warranty card says only one year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 15, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 hmmm, thats odd. They do in fact come with a lifetime warranty, so no worries. I also sell halo's that come with a 1 year warranty, i may have accidently given you one. Either way, i havey ou in my system, and you are covered for LIFE. No worries, if you'd like me to get you a lifetime card out i will. Chad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 Hey guys - just got some info i wanted to pass along to you: Here is the ballast operating info: Voltage In: 7.5 - 18.5 volts Voltage Norm. - 13.2 volts Impedance Norm - 3.2 amps Impedance IN max - 10amps Power out - 35 watts Voltage (Vstart) max - 23kv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 Here is a picture of my 6000k kits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 Here is a picture of my 6000k kits. Is that a GP GXP? It's hard to tell anymore with the front ends on Pontiacs. If so I traded a GXP for my Edge. Loved the car but not practical for Chicago weather. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 No, the GXP has the big buck-toothed front grill. That is just a G6 GT Coupe. BTW - did you get your HIDs installed? How do you like them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 20, 2008 Report Share Posted February 20, 2008 No, the GXP has the big buck-toothed front grill. That is just a G6 GT Coupe. BTW - did you get your HIDs installed? How do you like them? Not yet. Just a little cold around these parts lately. Plenty of sun but when the high is only 12 degrees and the wind is blowing at 20mph+ you don't feel like spending much time outside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 23, 2008 Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 (edited) Deleted Edited February 23, 2008 by jpeckinp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 23, 2008 Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 Just to let everybody know that I tried to install the kit today and it doesn't fit properly without modification. I'm discussing with Chad on a solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 PM sent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craiger Posted February 23, 2008 Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 Hey, can you please clarify about it not fitting. What isn't fitting? Bulbs? Are you sure you got the right kit? I bought a kit from Chad but I've had nothing but headaches with HID kits and the last thing I want is another kit not work for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 23, 2008 Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 Hey, can you please clarify about it not fitting. What isn't fitting? Bulbs? Are you sure you got the right kit? I bought a kit from Chad but I've had nothing but headaches with HID kits and the last thing I want is another kit not work for me. OK here is what is going on. The lights look great I had a small problem with the keying of the lights, nothing major the tabs are about 1/16 too wide to fit in the housing. I clipped the tab and the bulbs would go in but I couldn't get the light to lock in place from what I thought was the rubber ring not allowing it. Chad PM'd me back and indicated that the plastic ring needs to be removed and that should fix the problem. I will try tomorrow and see how it works. Also while I had the lights hooked up I didn't receive a light out warning and I'm not using the relays, so if that helps you any Craiger I don't know. I will post tomorrow on how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craiger Posted February 24, 2008 Report Share Posted February 24, 2008 Thanks for the update! Will removing the rubber ring affect the seal though? Glad to know the relay isn't needed...everyone with digital ballasts don't seem to need them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 24, 2008 Report Share Posted February 24, 2008 Thanks for the update! Will removing the rubber ring affect the seal though?Glad to know the relay isn't needed...everyone with digital ballasts don't seem to need them. I'm not removing the rubber ring it is the waterseal. There is a small opaque plastic ring that goes behind the rubber ring that should be removed and I thought it was a needed part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craiger Posted February 24, 2008 Report Share Posted February 24, 2008 That's good to know. I look forward to hearing the update and sure hope it works for you...and me Thanks for the info! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 24, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2008 Yes - that plastic ring is just to keep the bulb centered in the bulb holder during shipment. If it is still on and you try to install the bulb, it WILL NOT fit. You have to remove it. Once removed, you will have the necessary clearance for the bulb. I ran into the same problem the first time i installed a set of them. It looks like it should stay, but it does not. He is the "culprit". Remove it. Removed: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeckinp Posted February 24, 2008 Report Share Posted February 24, 2008 (edited) The lights are in and working. :happy feet: Now for the low down. You NEED the relay system, I must have got lucky yesterday and when I turned on the lights I must have been pulsed just right to get them to come on. I hooked back up today and only one light at a time would come on but if I turned the fogs on and off it would pulse the other light so if I done it fast the light came on to stay, that pretty much told me that yes I needed the relay. The ballast tie down was the worst part, trying to find a place to tie down on the driver side isn't easy. I ended up tying off to the wiring harness to the relay box. The passenger side I tied off to the washer fluid it was perfect. After the weather gets a little warmer I will also try a new place to tie off the driver side ballast I'll go out tonight and re-aim the lights and see how easy that will be. One thing I did notice that if you have the lights on for a few minutes to get at full temp and you shut them off and turn back on before they cool down they do a really cool strobing light show. It kind of looks like wig wags from a police car. Not recommended! You also hear the relay buzz but it's is easily drowned out by road noise or the radio. All in all if you know what you are doing they do install pretty fast, Chad is right 15-20 minutes and they should be up and running. If anybody wants to see pics let me know and I'll take some at night after they are aimed. One last thing. After you remove the plastic ring at the bottom of the light you need to pull the rubber gasket down in the spot where the ring was so it will fit in and lock in the housing. You might also need to clip the keyed part of the light so it will fit in the housing, I had to but that just might be me. Edited February 24, 2008 by jpeckinp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrenn71 Posted February 24, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2008 Glad to hear you got them up and running. If you want to be featured on my new website, shoot me some pictures to uniquecoating@yahoo.com You are the first person i've heard about having problems with the keys on the bulb socket. Look forward to seeing pics! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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