Hello, I haul cars, LOL!

[Carhaul Rich]

And I've ordered my first Edge, although I primarily haul Taurus's and Explorers. Along with nearly every other make with wheels.

 

My daily driver is a 2001 F-150 regular cab, short-bed, with a 5 over manual trans, Ford doesn't even offer them anymore. A 2008 was the last manual that I saw, tho Ford might have built a few manual trans 150s in 2009.

 

I also have a rebuilt '08 Mountaineer AWD, which we are very happy with. I gave it to my girl friend. Hopefully, she will be able to plow right through her 500 foot drive when it drifts over with snow when the north-west winds blow lake effect snows. After last winter, we're going to install some snow fencing too.

 

While looking for a car for Kay, I found a nearly perfect '08 Edge on my local dealer lot. She said she didn't want to pay the 18k they were asking for it. I figured that I'd buy it, but I knew it wouldn't last long. It only had one very tiny paint defect, about a quarter inch, with very low (40k) miles. I was right, that Edge was gone two days later.

 

At first I didn't understand why anyone would buy an Edge over an Explorer, they seem so similar, excepting the third row seating, and an Explorer doesn't really cost that much more. Then I hauled a few off-lease '12 Edges from one of Ford's marshaling yards to the auction with the tow packs, and I was impressed. Sporty dual exhaust tips and a full-blown two inch receiver, plus the same engine/drivetrain as the Explorer!

 

I decided to bite the bullet and order out my third new car ever. (the F-150 was also new, at fire-sale pricing). I am awaiting a Deep Impact Blue SEL with the 205a pack, Appearance pack, and tow package. It is really strange that most dealers do not typically spec the tow pack, for 395 bucks, sticker, it is a huge bargain, IMHO. This same car is featured in the official Ford brochure, too.

 

At any rate, I'm hoping that you guys can help me out with further engine and custom mods in the following years. I really want a Mustang, but a pony just doesn't work for me. And yes, I've hauled plenty of them too!

 

 

 

 

[Carhaul Rich]

BTW, I have a legitimate X-Plan. I am shocked that Ford seems to honor Pins without proof of association with partners. You are not supposed to be able to just hand them out. My local dealer will give anyone very close to X-Plan anyway, the difference was about 200 bucks.

Edited October 8, 2014 by Carhaul Rich

[TRMN8TR]

X plan is for friends and neighbors. A plan is for employee and family only. Congrats on your new edge, you'll love it. I'm on my 2nd one. My 14 sport is my favorite vehicle I've ever owned, and I've owned a TON of cars and trucks..

[WWWPerfA_ZN0W]

Welcome, Rich, and congrats on your soon-to-arrive Edge! What engine do you have in there? A custom tune (e.g., Unleashed Tuning/Torrie) will likely net you the most gains in performance/fuel economy. Catbacks may still be available from Magnaflow & Gibson. Check with CD3Performance on this site, or on their website. K&N CAI may or may not help. If you had a 3.7, you would've had the option of a different throttle body also. H&R Suspension Springs are another option (air suspension if you really want flexibility).

[akirby]

X plan is for friends and neighbors. A plan is for employee and family only. Congrats on your new edge, you'll love it. I'm on my 2nd one. My 14 sport is my favorite vehicle I've ever owned, and I've owned a TON of cars and trucks..

 

Not true. X plan is also for Ford partner companies through fordpartner.com. Same pins, same rules as friends and neighbors but you have to work for the company and show proof of employment.

 

BTW, I have a legitimate X-Plan. I am shocked that Ford seems to honor Pins without proof of association with partners. You are not supposed to be able to just hand them out.

 

Employees can hand them out to friends and neighbors but you're supposed to know the person not just give them out randomly. I have heard employees getting interrogated about it.

 

For Ford Partner X plan pins the dealer MUST verify employment. I had to take my badge or paystub. If yours was a partner pin and the dealer didn't do that then they're not following the rules and an audit could take away all their plan privileges.

[Carhaul Rich]

From Ford's X-Plan "How it works" page:

 

<quote>

 

PROGRAM DESCRIPTIONS AND ELIGIBILITY

 

X-Plan

 

Partner Recognition:

An eligible Partner Recognition employee or retiree may generate up to two (2) PINs per calendar year to be used towards the purchase/lease of a new vehicle for them or members of their households as noted below (see PIN Generation for details):

• Employees (full time, part-time and contract), retirees and spouses of eligible Partner companies (suppliers, fleets, etc.) and members of specific organizations or groups.
• Residents of the same household as listed above(driver’s license required for proof of residency).
• Participation is by invitation only as determined by Ford Motor Company. Not all suppliers, fleets, etc. are eligible. </quote>

 

I do not have any first-hand knowledge of Ford dealers honoring X-Plan pins without verification. So I mis-spoke. I stated that solely on the number of posts from people asking for them across the web.

 

Also, my local dealer is a no-haggle dealer. Anyone can walk in and get very close to X-Plan pricing right off of the street. The difference in my case was pretty much the doc fee.

[Carhaul Rich]

Welcome, Rich, and congrats on your soon-to-arrive Edge! What engine do you have in there? A custom tune (e.g., Unleashed Tuning/Torrie) will likely net you the most gains in performance/fuel economy. Catbacks may still be available from Magnaflow & Gibson. Check with CD3Performance on this site, or on their website. K&N CAI may or may not help. If you had a 3.7, you would've had the option of a different throttle body also. H&R Suspension Springs are another option (air suspension if you really want flexibility).

 

Exactly the info that I'll be interested in.

 

My dealer is trading for my Edge with a dealer in Milwaukee. It is supposed to be here today, unfortunately, I won't be here today.

 

I'd love to have the 3.7, I'm pretty sure that is the same engine as the base Mustang. It is only available in the Sport model, and the Sport model is not available with the towing package, so I'll have to make do with the 285 HP 3.5, LOL!

 

By comparison, my '01 F-150 has a 4.2 V6, and it only generates around 210 HP. The small V8 from that model year only developed 220 HP. Things have come a long way in the past decade, which is one reason I'm pulling the trigger now. I'd be surprised to see performance like this ten years from now. (I remember the mid-seventies)

Edited October 8, 2014 by Carhaul Rich

[akirby]

 

I do not have any first-hand knowledge of Ford dealers honoring X-Plan pins without verification. So I mis-spoke. I stated that solely on the number of posts from people asking for them across the web.

 

That's only the Ford Partner X plan rules. There is a separate plan for Ford employees to give out pins for Friends and Family. They used to have 4 pins per year they can give out to anyone they "know". I think they clamped down on what "know" means and they may have cut the number of pins but as far as I know it's still in place and that's what you see people requesting on blueovalforums.com and other websites. There is no confirmation required for that program.

[Carhaul Rich]

So each A plan Ford employee also has their own personal X-Plan allotment to dole out? No wonder I have been confused, thanks for clearing that up for me!

 

I've had small-town dealers themselves tell me that they could do as good or better than X-Plan anyway. They probably didn't want to deal with the added paperwork.

 

Still, it does make a good starting point for arm-wrestling, LOL!

[akirby]

So each A plan Ford employee also has their own personal X-Plan allotment to dole out? No wonder I have been confused, thanks for clearing that up for me!

 

I've had small-town dealers themselves tell me that they could do as good or better than X-Plan anyway. They probably didn't want to deal with the added paperwork.

 

Still, it does make a good starting point for arm-wrestling, LOL!

 

They used to (up to 4 per year). Not sure if that's changed recently. Like I said there was some abuse and actions were taken.

 

X plan used to be below true dealer invoice but now it's about $250 above dealer invoice so it is possible for the dealer to beat it.

 

HOWEVER

 

If you walk in with a X plan pin and the dealer says he can do better without it, you have to ask yourself this question. Since every x plan sale nets the dealer an additional few hundred dollars from Ford (spiff check) which is pure additional profit, why would the dealer turn that down and try to get you to buy one for less money and without the spiff check unless they are making it up somewhere else with a higher doc fee (X plan is $100 max) or other add-on fees or items that are not allowed with X plan. Or they're lowballing your trade-in. The other explanation is their plan privileges were taken away from them by Ford so they can't take your PIN.

 

There are legitimate cheaper deals out there (although I don't know why a dealer would sell a new vehicle at their actual cost with no profit) but you need to be careful and understand the true final price.

[CARR142]

The more vehicles a dealer sells, gives him more options when he orders vehicles from Ford corporation

"Priority satus", they, (dealers), strive to be #1. Told to me by a Ford sales manger.

[akirby]

Being #1 doesn't help if you lose money on every vehicle.

 

It just means you go out of business faster.

Edited October 8, 2014 by akirby

[Carhaul Rich]

The more vehicles a dealer sells, gives him more options when he orders vehicles from Ford corporation

"Priority satus", they, (dealers), strive to be #1. Told to me by a Ford sales manger.

That is certainly true for specialty vehicles, such as the 2012-2013 Boss 302s and the 2013-2014 Shelby GT500s. Dealer allocation was based solely on previous dealer Mustang sales.

[ls973800]

Being #1 doesn't help if you lose money on every vehicle.

 

It just means you go out of business faster.

Unless you are the owner of a dealership or one of the top personnel in the dealership, very few people know the REAL cost of the vehicle. If you think the dealership is losing money by selling under invoice, or by selling at less than X-plan to an X-plan eligible buyer, then you are mistaken.

 

I and at least one other owner here have posted how we both purchased our Edge at the A plan price shown on the invoice. Neither of us worked for Ford or signed any paperwork saying we did. We each purchased from different dealerships. I actually got the price from 2 dealerships, before buying from the closest one. There were no excessive doc fees, add-ons, excessive interest rates, etc. All rebates and even special financing were also given with the sale. We believed that Ford was doing some type of market Conquest incentive without it being made public. In other words, if the dealer could sell the Edge only by offering such a low price in order to make the sale, then that is what Ford wanted.

 

You could believe that the dealer lost a thousand or two on those sales, but there is NO way they would have ever sold at that price unless there was some type of UNKNOWN or PRIVATE incentive to them from Ford.

 

There are additional spiffs, rebates, incentives, programs, rewards, ect which only the dealer knows about. Look at the bottom of EVERY invoice for a car or truck, and there will be a statement along the lines that the price shown is NOT the true cost of the vehicle to the dealer due to various incentives, special factory programs, etc.

 

Yes, the dealer isn't making as much money by selling at those reduced prices at the sale time, but there are additional bonuses for units sold, money made in the finance department, etc.

 

Less profit? Yes. Losing money? No way.

[akirby]

Unless you are the owner of a dealership or one of the top personnel in the dealership, very few people know the REAL cost of the vehicle. If you think the dealership is losing money by selling under invoice, or by selling at less than X-plan to an X-plan eligible buyer, then you are mistaken.

 

I and at least one other owner here have posted how we both purchased our Edge at the A plan price shown on the invoice. Neither of us worked for Ford or signed any paperwork saying we did. We each purchased from different dealerships. I actually got the price from 2 dealerships, before buying from the closest one. There were no excessive doc fees, add-ons, excessive interest rates, etc. All rebates and even special financing were also given with the sale. We believed that Ford was doing some type of market Conquest incentive without it being made public. In other words, if the dealer could sell the Edge only by offering such a low price in order to make the sale, then that is what Ford wanted.

 

You could believe that the dealer lost a thousand or two on those sales, but there is NO way they would have ever sold at that price unless there was some type of UNKNOWN or PRIVATE incentive to them from Ford.

 

There are additional spiffs, rebates, incentives, programs, rewards, ect which only the dealer knows about. Look at the bottom of EVERY invoice for a car or truck, and there will be a statement along the lines that the price shown is NOT the true cost of the vehicle to the dealer due to various incentives, special factory programs, etc.

 

Yes, the dealer isn't making as much money by selling at those reduced prices at the sale time, but there are additional bonuses for units sold, money made in the finance department, etc.

 

Less profit? Yes. Losing money? No way.

 

I understand exactly how dealership cost works. The dealer pays the true invoice price (what is printed on the invoice including FDAF and other fees) and gets 3% holdback from Ford which puts the actual cost of the vehicle right at A plan price before any special dealer incentives. On an actual A plan sale Ford gives the dealer an extra few hundred bucks (same for X plan). So let's say they're breaking even on the vehicle but making a small profit on the special incentives and bonuses. That profit is eaten up quickly by sales commission, finance and the overhead of just keeping the lights on in the showroom. Now factor in any floor plan interest costs and it's not hard to see that dealers are either breaking even or losing a little on new vehicle sales.

 

Apparently some dealers have chosen to make all their profit on service and used car sales which is fine if it works.

[ls973800]

 

I understand exactly how dealership cost works. The dealer pays the true invoice price (what is printed on the invoice including FDAF and other fees) and gets 3% holdback from Ford which puts the actual cost of the vehicle right at A plan price before any special dealer incentives. On an actual A plan sale Ford gives the dealer an extra few hundred bucks (same for X plan). So let's say they're breaking even on the vehicle but making a small profit on the special incentives and bonuses. That profit is eaten up quickly by sales commission, finance and the overhead of just keeping the lights on in the showroom. Now factor in any floor plan interest costs and it's not hard to see that dealers are either breaking even or losing a little on new vehicle sales.

 

Apparently some dealers have chosen to make all their profit on service and used car sales which is fine if it works.

 

If you think the dealer only gets 3% holdback and only pays the printed "true" invoice price, then that's what you believe. We will never know what hidden or factory incentives go to the dealer only, so we will never know the true cost of what the dealer actually pays for each vehicle.

 

I just got a 2015 beginning of this month. Leather, navigation, auto climate control, etc. Not a stripped out or undesirably equipped model at all. I got all the holdback given up, plus some extra money off! No trade, no excessive doc fees, absolutely no add ons. Got all the rebates and 1.9 financing. How was the dealer able to sell and still make money? There turned out to be some additional hidden money given to each GM dealer to help sales because of the numerous recalls in the last few months.

 

The finance manager showed me $500.00 worth of "coupons" they used on my deal which allowed me to buy from them instead of elsewhere. These "coupons" were given by GM to be used at the dealers discretion and in what ever amount they wanted to, with each "coupon" having a value of $250.00! I had shopped at 3 other dealers and didn't know about these extra incentives. I spent over 5 hours negotiating the price, and didn't believe they went as low as they did. While signing the fiance papers, the sales manager and finance manager explained about the extra money they put forward to win the sale.

 

I would have thought they lost money because they gave up invoice, holdback, and even more money but because of not knowing their true costs, they didn't lose money. They can keep the lights on for another day. The next customer may pay sticker, so they might even be able to pay their bills! Or they may sell the next buyer rust proofing, extended warranty, paint protection, maintenance plans, etc. More money is made on the back end of the deal in the finance office than on the sale itself many times. They also get a "kickback" on the finance charges so again, who really knows how much they make on either end.

 

Floor plan costs usually don't start until I believe 30 days or so after the unit has hit the dealers lot. That's one reason they want you to buy out of their stock.

[akirby]

I already acknowledged that there are additional incentives for the dealer - bonuses, etc. that can provide profit after the sale.

 

The coupons you're talking about are just additional factory incentives - that doesn't come out of the dealer's pocket. In my example all factory incentives come off of the factory invoice price because those are factory to customer incentives and the dealer is not involved. There can be dealer cash on top of that and of course that adds profit for the dealer.

 

But very few dealers regularly sell below dealer invoice and even less sell at A plan prices without a pin and without huge doc fees.

 

For Ford dealer cash is usually only on previous model years and if you use X plan or A plan you get it in the form of an additional rebate. Edmunds publishes the dealer cash on their website.

 

I'm not saying it's impossible - just rare.