X-Plan e-mailed by dealer

[Qballgreg]

I filled out a "build your own" form on a local ford website, which was sent to a local dealer near my zip code. I was e-mailed a PIN # from them...I presume an X-Plan PIN. Is this legit, and what is the best way to use in order to get the best discount?

[Grey]

Did you give them your name, address, social security number (last 4)?

 

Could be a come-on.

 

When there are incentives, almoct any dealer would sell at X-Plan and keep the incentives.

[Qballgreg]

Did you give them your name, address, social security number (last 4)?

 

Could be a come-on.

 

When there are incentives, almoct any dealer would sell at X-Plan and keep the incentives.

 

I'm thinking it was a come-on...as they sent an "KI PIN", whatever that is.....could someone fully explain the X-PLan?

[07 MKX]

could someone fully explain the X-PLan?

 

 

Do a SEARCH... I uploaded the complete X-pin info in a post.

 

Yes, what he did was non-approved by Ford. And the pin is only good for 30 days. And if not used it counts against the person who issued it. It is a Friends and Neighbor/Family price offered by Ford Employees.

[Grey]

A real X-Plan pin is usually good to the end of the year or until the sponsor cancels it. If canceled, it does not count against the sponsors allowable pins. Pin eligibility starts over every January.

 

When BON was promoting the wholesale bastardazation of the plan, they would tell you to use it in 30 days or it would be cancelled.

 

Now that Ford has slapped their hands and are watching the requests, the activity has slowed down.

 

I've given out over 100 pins through the years - mostly to neighbors to get them out of a competitive vehicle and some to family members who can't use A/Z plan pins (nephews, etc.) Several dealers told my sponsored customers that they would sell them a vehicle at X-Plan price without the pin. They bought the deal only to find out later that if they had used the pin, there were other incentives they would have been eligible for. The dealer pocketed the incentives and the customer paid more than they should have (at least in my mind.)

 

But, it raises the age old question - "What is a fair profit on a high ticket item?" If you promise a salesperson a comission that is greater than the profit you make on a vehicle then you have multiple problems.

 

"If you want to make a small fortune, take a big fortune and invest in a car dealership."

[akirby]

A real X-Plan pin is usually good to the end of the year or until the sponsor cancels it. If canceled, it does not count against the sponsors allowable pins. Pin eligibility starts over every January.

 

When BON was promoting the wholesale bastardazation of the plan, they would tell you to use it in 30 days or it would be cancelled.

 

Now that Ford has slapped their hands and are watching the requests, the activity has slowed down.

 

I've given out over 100 pins through the years - mostly to neighbors to get them out of a competitive vehicle and some to family members who can't use A/Z plan pins (nephews, etc.) Several dealers told my sponsored customers that they would sell them a vehicle at X-Plan price without the pin. They bought the deal only to find out later that if they had used the pin, there were other incentives they would have been eligible for. The dealer pocketed the incentives and the customer paid more than they should have (at least in my mind.)

 

But, it raises the age old question - "What is a fair profit on a high ticket item?" If you promise a salesperson a comission that is greater than the profit you make on a vehicle then you have multiple problems.

 

"If you want to make a small fortune, take a big fortune and invest in a car dealership."

 

Absolutely correct, except that an issued PIN is good for 1 year from the date of issue, not until the end of the year.

 

Maybe you could explain this to macaw who thinks his dealer is actually selling him a vehicle at $150 under the X plan price. I told him the dealer wouldn't do that on a popular vehicle unless he was keeping rebates or adding big documentation fees but he doesn't believe me.

[Qballgreg]

A real X-Plan pin is usually good to the end of the year or until the sponsor cancels it. If canceled, it does not count against the sponsors allowable pins. Pin eligibility starts over every January.

 

When BON was promoting the wholesale bastardazation of the plan, they would tell you to use it in 30 days or it would be cancelled.

 

Now that Ford has slapped their hands and are watching the requests, the activity has slowed down.

 

I've given out over 100 pins through the years - mostly to neighbors to get them out of a competitive vehicle and some to family members who can't use A/Z plan pins (nephews, etc.) Several dealers told my sponsored customers that they would sell them a vehicle at X-Plan price without the pin. They bought the deal only to find out later that if they had used the pin, there were other incentives they would have been eligible for. The dealer pocketed the incentives and the customer paid more than they should have (at least in my mind.)

 

But, it raises the age old question - "What is a fair profit on a high ticket item?" If you promise a salesperson a comission that is greater than the profit you make on a vehicle then you have multiple problems.

 

"If you want to make a small fortune, take a big fortune and invest in a car dealership."

 

So...I would need to request a "PIN" from someone, and then present to a dealer for a better price?

[Grey]

"Absolutely correct, except that an issued PIN is good for 1 year from the date of issue, not until the end of the year."

 

Akirby- I cancel any open pins at the end of the year so I don't get surprised by an old one using up one of this years allotment. Are you saying I could provide 4 pins at the end of 2007 for use in early 2008 and they not count against the 2008 allotment when used? I didn't think so, but I don't know for sure.

 

If that is the case, I have left some on the table.

 

I've about given up on trying to explain some of the elements of vehicle cost. Seems like everyone has their own ideas about how much profit a dealer should make on a sale and they believe what they see in a forum is the absolute truth. Goes back to "If you think you got a great deal, then you did!"

[akirby]

Akirby- I cancel any open pins at the end of the year so I don't get surprised by an old one using up one of this years allotment. Are you saying I could provide 4 pins at the end of 2007 for use in early 2008 and they not count against the 2008 allotment when used? I didn't think so, but I don't know for sure.

 

I'm not an employee (I get my pins through the Ford Pattner program) but my understanding is that the PIN counts against your allotment when it's issued, not when it's used. So you can issue 4 this year with none of them used and you'll get 4 more in January regardless of what happens with the previous 4. Of course you should check with the employee plan admin site or other employees to be sure but I'm 98% sure that's the case.

[akirby]

So...I would need to request a "PIN" from someone, and then present to a dealer for a better price?

 

You have 2 options - wait for a PIN from an employee, then go shopping and give the dealer your PIN

 

OR

 

Go shopping now, tell the dealer you'll be getting an X plan pin and then get one before you take delivery. The dealers usually won't have a problem telling you the X plan price without a PIN. If they do then we can look up prices for you on in-stock vehicles.

 

The only thing you're not supposed to do is negotiate for the vehicle first, then pull out the PIN. You need to tell the dealer upfront that you'll be using X plan.

[cobra7]

The only thing you're not supposed to do is negotiate for the vehicle first, then pull out the PIN. You need to tell the dealer upfront that you'll be using X plan.

 

What about your trade-in? Shouldn't you negotiate that first and then pull out your plan PIN to get the pricing on the new vehicle? I always fear letting a dealer know that I get Z-Plan before I get an acceptable number on my trade-in. It seems that they would low-ball the trade knowing that I'm buying the new vehicle at Z-Plan price.

[akirby]

What about your trade-in? Shouldn't you negotiate that first and then pull out your plan PIN to get the pricing on the new vehicle? I always fear letting a dealer know that I get Z-Plan before I get an acceptable number on my trade-in. It seems that they would low-ball the trade knowing that I'm buying the new vehicle at Z-Plan price.

 

You call it low-balling - I would call it right-balling.

 

The closer to retail you pay for the car the higher the trade-in value. This isn't because your trade-in is worth more - the dealer is just moving your discount out of the new car price and into the trade-in value.

 

If you're paying close to retail you should expect a retail trade-in value. If you're paying wholesale (or close to it) then you should only expect a wholesale trade-in value.

 

Your trade-in is really only worth wholesale anyway. Why would a used car manager give you $15,000 for a car he can go buy at auction any day of the week for $12,500? Now if you just ask for a trade-in appraisal stand alone instead of it being baked into a retail purchase then that should be ok. But it wouldn't really be fair to the dealer to get a price of $1000 over invoice with one trade-in value and expect to get X plan pricing and still get the same trade-in value.

 

You can do retail/retail or wholesale/wholesale but not wholesale purchase/retail trade-in. What you can do is shop around for the best trade-in price since the A/Z/X plan price for the vehicle will be the same anywhere.