Can someone explaing the X Plan Process?

[cmoses]

I am looking to purchase a car by the end of the year. I am leaning towards the Ford Edge at this time. I have purchased a couple of cars in the past and am pretty good at the whole "process" of buying a car. I do a lot of research, know what I want, and am never rushed. I find the car that I want and then wait until I can get the best price. Through use of bargining, rebates, dealer encentives, etc. While researching the Edge on this forum, I ran across posts about the X Plan Pin numbers. After reading about it, I think that the X Plan would allow me to get the best price possible. Especially if I can stack the incentives, invoice pricing + interest rate + rebate and maybe incentives. Since I do not have a friend or family member that works for Ford, when the time comes I will see if I can obtain a pin through the Ford Edge Forum or the Blue Oval Forum.

 

If I can obtain one, I was curious as to what the process would be as far as going to the dealer and presenting it? Do they ask you where you got it? Who your friend or family member is? Or do they just verify the pin and go from there?

 

Once they have verified the pin number does the rest just fall into place? Special pricing, no added fees, stacked incentives?

 

I know that they are supposed to show you the invoice with the X Plan pricing on it. Do you get the options at invoice price as well or just the car and standard model options at invoice?

 

The one thing that I read on the X Plan Pin that confused the most was that you are not supposed to have talked to a salesperson before presenting the X Plan Pin number. How would you know that you wanted to purchase a Ford, let alone which model if you haven't looked or test driven them.

 

Any additional information about the X Plan purchase process that you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks again for all the usefull information this forum provides.

Clayton

Edited September 27, 2007 by cmoses

[Good_Hands]

Cool! You will love the Edge.

 

The dealer will see that your Pin number is active/good and then go from there.

 

Some (most) dealers are happy to help you with a "plan" price because that salesman still gets credit for "moving the unit." This helps him/her with any sales contests, etc. I get the Z plan (dad is retired) but I have had friends who used friends-and-family Pins actually get better prices than with the Pin.

 

It's really a great way to go. You can go to many websites (Ford.com, MSN.com, etc) and price out your car with exactly what you want. Walk into the dealer and hand it to the salesman. They find one, show you the prices, and you are done.

 

Only haggling would be on a trade-in. Also, you would do better to already be pre-approved for a loan (if you are using one). Sometimes you can get a better percentage rate from the dealer - especially if you fudge on the numbers you got from the bank. My wife and I did this for her Honda. She was preapproved at 4.9 from our bank. We told the dealer she was approved at 3.9 but if they could match it, we'd go with them.

 

They matched the 3.9 and we saved a point.

[akirby]

You don't have to present your PIN number to the dealer up front - just disclose that you'll be using one before you start negotiating on price. If the dealer gives you a trade-in value based on a regular retail sale and THEN you pull out your X plan pin the trade-in price might change and then people get angry, but it's only fair.

 

Once you figure out what vehicle you want, pick a dealer, call the sales manager and ask if they'll accept X plan on that vehicle. They don't have to - it's 100% voluntary, but shouldn't be a problem.

 

Your PIN number is registered to you and is in the system with your personal information. You just need to provide proof of identity along with the PIN number for validation. The dealer doesn't need anything else and if they ask they're just being nosy.

 

Since the price is the same at all dealers with X plan just pick the one you like or the one that gives you the best trade-in (based on X plan purchase of course).

[Grey]

There is an inherent problem with X-Plan Pins over the internet. Ford tell us not to offer them unless you really know the vehicle buyer and then only if that will really influence them to buy the vehicle. We can loose our A/Z/D plan privileges if we are caught passing them out to strangers. (That would be bad!)

 

If you follow what has happened on BlueOval, they have cut back on requests and passing out of PINs. Some employees and retirees have lost their plan privileges over this.

 

There are a lot of companies that have X-Plan privileges for their employees due to a business relationship with Ford. Ask yours.

 

So don't count on getting one - might happen - but who knows. Best to find someone that works for Ford and befriend them if your company is not one with X-Plan. Ask around - "Who works for Ford, or Ford Credit, or is retired from Ford?"

[nickys.edge]

i was asked by the dealer im buying from for the issuers name to validate the pin....im not sure if thats ok or not but i never heard of them asking for their name because it is issued to your ssn!!

[akirby]

i was asked by the dealer im buying from for the issuers name to validate the pin....im not sure if thats ok or not but i never heard of them asking for their name because it is issued to your ssn!!

 

No, it's not ok. They don't need that info. Ford has it right there in their computer so if Ford wanted it then they already have it. All they need is the PIN and your id. Period.

[Grey]

No, it's not ok. They don't need that info. Ford has it right there in their computer so if Ford wanted it then they already have it. All they need is the PIN and your id. Period.

 

I think the dealer smelled something. The PIN was not given by a friend or neighbor, but obtained in a fashion not approved by Ford. You are correct, they don't need the info, but perhaps they would like to verify their suspicions. They might have backed out of the deal at x-plan so as not to be involved.

 

A ligitimate x-plan customer should have their approval (pin) before they begin negotiating on a vehicle. Neither Ford or the dealership (especially the salesperson) appreciate an X-plan buyer back dooring the deal.

 

I've seen instances where dealers will tell a customer that they will give them the X-Plan price, show them the invoice with the x-plan price clearly stated on it and never file for the adjustment from Ford. That way they are free to charge document fees, etc. and keep any allowances for themselves.

[Good_Hands]

i was asked by the dealer im buying from for the issuers name to validate the pin....im not sure if thats ok or not but i never heard of them asking for their name because it is issued to your ssn!!

 

 

Did you end up getting the car at the X-plan price?

[07 MKX]

I think the dealer smelled something. The PIN was not given by a friend or neighbor, but obtained in a fashion not approved by Ford. You are correct, they don't need the info, but perhaps they would like to verify their suspicions. They might have backed out of the deal at x-plan so as not to be involved.

 

A ligitimate x-plan customer should have their approval (pin) before they begin negotiating on a vehicle. Neither Ford or the dealership (especially the salesperson) appreciate an X-plan buyer back dooring the deal.

 

I've seen instances where dealers will tell a customer that they will give them the X-Plan price, show them the invoice with the x-plan price clearly stated on it and never file for the adjustment from Ford. That way they are free to charge document fees, etc. and keep any allowances for themselves.

 

Grey, an X-plan use to be called Friends and Family. That would mean niece's and nephews, and those can be scattered across the country. That dealership didn't need the name of who issued it at all. The number just needed to be checked to see if it was valid, and not made up.

 

On a Side note, how do you feel about our dealership 'friend' Lou posting this?

 

Hello Everyone: My name is Lou Rosario.

If you are giving away your xplan pin numbers, I would be glad to assist your friend in the sale.

Lou Rosario

 

Here he is asking for unused pin's...

[akirby]

Grey, an X-plan use to be called Friends and Family. That would mean niece's and nephews, and those can be scattered across the country. That dealership didn't need the name of who issued it at all. The number just needed to be checked to see if it was valid, and not made up.

 

On a Side note, how do you feel about our dealership 'friend' Lou posting this?

 

Hello Everyone: My name is Lou Rosario.

If you are giving away your xplan pin numbers, I would be glad to assist your friend in the sale.

Lou Rosario

 

Here he is asking for unused pin's...

 

No, he's saying if you give a PIN to a friend he would be glad to sell the friend or family member a vehicle on the plan. That's not the same thing as asking for or offering PINs.

[07 MKX]

Grumble, Grumble.... perhaps, it's that I have a large distaste for car salesmen. I suppose it's only me.

[Grey]

Grumble, Grumble.... perhaps, it's that I have a large distaste for car salesmen. I suppose it's only me.

 

I guess you don't really have a dog in this hunt - just wanted to get something off your chest?

 

Over 40 years ago when I began requesting X-Plans, you needed a V.P. or GSM approval. The qualifications eased up over the years, BUT it is still controlled and the rules are expected to be followed.

Ford clearly says not to offer PINS over the internet to "strangers". That is why Blue Oval has taken down their forum. Sure it happens but they also get caught doing it. Usually when a customer tells their salesperson that they are going fishing for one or got it over a forum. If the customer has not played fair then they might want to turn them in.

 

The rules require you to alert the dealership that you are buying x-plan before you begin negotiating. Not sure that happened here.

[07 MKX]

I guess you don't really have a dog in this hunt - just wanted to get something off your chest?

 

Sorry Grey, My dog's in play here.

[Good_Hands]

The rules require you to alert the dealership that you are buying x-plan before you begin negotiating. Not sure that happened here.

 

I have purchased 4 cars using PIN numbers. I have NEVER told them before the negotiating that I had a PIN.

 

I tell them I'm going to buy but before we do anything else, I want to negotiate for my trade.

 

I never had a problem doing this.

[AWDEDGE]

When I bought our Edge, here's the way it went

Arrived at dealer and told them I would be buying by x plan

after being optioned out....dealer gave me print out of regular invoice and x plan price with options listed almost 3k difference.....once ordered and 4 weeks later ....it arrived.....went to pick it up and needed our PIN # and ID and a pay check stub verifing employment with company being offered x plan......it was that simple!

Edited September 28, 2007 by AWDEDGE

[Grey]

I have purchased 4 cars using PIN numbers. I have NEVER told them before the negotiating that I had a PIN.

 

I tell them I'm going to buy but before we do anything else, I want to negotiate for my trade.

 

I never had a problem doing this.

 

Guess you have been lucky. What if someone was upside down in their trade and the dealership used part of their normal profit to make up the difference (over allow on the trade)? Once the X-Plan pin was revealed and the dealership's cost structure was dramitically changed, they would have every right to back off the trade price quoted.

 

Then again, they may know you by now.

[Good_Hands]

Guess you have been lucky. What if someone was upside down in their trade and the dealership used part of their normal profit to make up the difference (over allow on the trade)? Once the X-Plan pin was revealed and the dealership's cost structure was dramitically changed, they would have every right to back off the trade price quoted.

 

Then again, they may know you by now.

 

In my situation, I wasn't upside down so that wasn't a factor. And it was 4 different dealers so they don't know me.

 

Guess I was lucky.

 

:shades:

[akirby]

In my situation, I wasn't upside down so that wasn't a factor. And it was 4 different dealers so they don't know me.

 

Guess I was lucky.

 

:shades:

 

 

The rules clearly say you have to identify yourself immediately. Normally this isn't a problem but if the dealer was pissed he could probably get your PIN revoked.

[Good_Hands]

The rules clearly say you have to identify yourself immediately. Normally this isn't a problem but if the dealer was pissed he could probably get your PIN revoked.

 

"shrug"

 

I'm kind of doubting they would go to that extreme.

 

He would probably refuse to honor the PIN and tell me to go elsewhere. It is their option.

 

There are some dealers that won't even consider making an "___" - plan deal.

[Grey]

The rules clearly say you have to identify yourself immediately. Normally this isn't a problem but if the dealer was pissed he could probably get your PIN revoked.

 

 

I know there are exceptions to every rule, but it always seemed to me that you are generally correct to play by them. I am aware of several plan buyers that decided they didn't have to play by the rules and got charged back the commission that Ford paid to the dealership on their vehicle. (look at the elements that you agree to, in order to get the deal!) The employees that lost their privileges usually got them back after a couple of years. It wouldn't be worth it to me - but I guess I'm a Wuss.

 

After Ford make such a deal over Blue Oval brokering pins, I'm sure they would like to find instances where the rules were broken, just to make examples.

Edited September 29, 2007 by Grey

[freedomlou]

Grey, an X-plan use to be called Friends and Family. That would mean niece's and nephews, and those can be scattered across the country. That dealership didn't need the name of who issued it at all. The number just needed to be checked to see if it was valid, and not made up.

 

On a Side note, how do you feel about our dealership 'friend' Lou posting this?

 

Hello Everyone: My name is Lou Rosario.

If you are giving away your xplan pin numbers, I would be glad to assist your friend in the sale.

Lou Rosario

 

Here he is asking for unused pin's...

This is not correct. If you write I state"If you are giving away your xplan pin numbers, I would be glad to assist your friend in the sale." I believe that means: If are a x-plan pin holder and are giving a pin to a friend, I would be glad to assist in the sale. I have not or owuld not request unused pins from anyone. I have 7 of my own.

Let me correct something else. We as sales representative with Ford we do have a form to fill out as to who was the sponsered the x -plan pin number. If you want correct information about any Ford buying program feel free to call me at 757-583-3673. I would glad to give correct a accurate information before you my a purchase.

[08 Edge]

This is not correct. If you write I state"If you are giving away your xplan pin numbers, I would be glad to assist your friend in the sale." I believe that means: If are a x-plan pin holder and are giving a pin to a friend, I would be glad to assist in the sale. I have not or owuld not request unused pins from anyone. I have 7 of my own.

Let me correct something else. We as sales representative with Ford we do have a form to fill out as to who was the sponsered the x -plan pin number. If you want correct information about any Ford buying program feel free to call me at 757-583-3673. I would glad to give correct a accurate information before you my a purchase.

 

Again, this isn't true, I personally know of 3 pins that were redeemed and never once was a 'sponcer' name needed or offered to complete the sale.

 

lou is a sales rep. for the dealership owner, Not Ford. The dealership BUYS the vehicle from Ford. They employe people to sell the car/truck for the Dealership. Lou is not paided by Ford. Salesmen will travel across the street and start selling a car for the competition the very next day, because that dealer offers them a better 'rate' than the previous one. Then the very next day switch to one down the street for the same reason. What is the national ranking of car salesmen on an overall job survey of 100 carrer perceptions of the public? 99 out of 100, just above lawyers, at 100 out of 100.

[Good_Hands]

Again, this isn't true, I personally know of 3 pins that were redeemed and never once was a 'sponcer' name needed or offered to complete the sale.

 

I can echo this. I have supplied many friends/in-laws with pins (through my dad) over the years and the only thing they ever had to supply was the PIN number.

 

I gave my dad their name, social security, and DOB. Dad gets the PIN. To be honest, I have no idea if he needed all that, but I gave it to him. I give the PIN to the person. The person supplied the PIN to the dealer.

 

Finito.

[macaw]

Just some notes on the X-Plan having just spent a lot of time researching it and using it for a purchase...

 

1. X-Plan doesn't mean a good price -- just a fixed price. I (or anyone really) was able to negotiate under X-Plan pricing even on an 08 pre-order. I got an X-Plan quote from one dealer, showed it to another and he offered me $150 below the X-Plan price.

 

2. The X-Plan can become a good deal if there is a particular incentive at the time of purchase you can apply on top of X-Plan. In that regard it's better to use X-Plan rather than just a negotiated deal if you foresee using any lease incentives or discounts.

 

3. The X-Plan calculators and sample invoices from Ford sites are deceiving. "Invoice" includes non-invoice items like regional advertising fees.

 

4. Remember when you're buying a Ford edge you're buying a value car so treat it like a commodity purchase. Buying a Lexus where you get service loaners, a very well built car with high residual values, and a glossy broshure from a suited salesman that must have cost $15 to print, will be quite different than your Ford purchase. My point is that your bottom line purchase price is probably all that matters because it's a commodity.

 

5. The X-Plan beats the Coscto plan by a huge margin. In fact the Coscto plan is really, really bad and should never be used.

[akirby]

I got an X-Plan quote from one dealer, showed it to another and he offered me $150 below the X-Plan price.

 

Sure he did. Then he's going to add a $400 documentation fee and maybe some "dealer accessories" to make up for it. Or he's taking it out of the trade-in. Or he's keeping the rebate. None of which is allowed under X plan rules.

 

The dealer gets a spiff check from Ford on every A/X/Z plan sale. X plan is also below invoice on Fords. Why would a dealer give up the spiff check and sell you a vehicle $250 below actual invoice (eating into the holdback) on a popular vehicle? Unless you're getting a special deal from the owner - not likely.

 

The X-Plan can become a good deal if there is a particular incentive at the time of purchase you can apply on top of X-Plan. In that regard it's better to use X-Plan rather than just a negotiated deal if you foresee using any lease incentives or discounts.

Any regular incentive you'd qualify for on a normal purchase are still applicable to X plan purchases. Some special rebates (like AQHA) can't be used but there are sometimes special plan only rebates available that make X plan even better. These are typically done when the mfr is offering dealer incentives that aren't advertised.

The X-Plan calculators and sample invoices from Ford sites are deceiving. "Invoice" includes non-invoice items like regional advertising fees.

They are not deceiving. Invoice is invoice - that's what Ford charges the dealer. Of course the dealer gets up to 3% back on the holdback but the advertising fees on the invoice are 100% legitimate. The dealer pays this to Ford on each vehicle and then Ford gives that money to the local dealer association to cover local dealer ads. The dealer doesn't keep any of that money or the fuel surcharge, etc. There is nothing deceptive about it.

 

Unless you have a special arrangement with the owner or you're buying a vehicle that the dealership really, really wants to get rid of - you're not going to beat X plan.

Edited October 27, 2007 by akirby