Navigation Issues

[Sharbotcom]

Let me start off by saying I'm new to this forum, so hello everyone. We took delivery in early December of a new '13 Edge as my wife's daily driver. We are having all kinds of trouble with the navigation system. Specifically, (to coin a phrase from our Australian friends) it thinks we are going on a "walk about". in other words, it can't seem to consistently figure out exactly where we are. Generally it will start off showing that we are fairly close, if not exactly where we are and continue to be correct for most of our trip (providing it is a short trip < 10 miles). On the return trip it might do so well. An by not so well, I mean while retracing the exact route we took only returning in the opposite direction, it will start to show our location to slowly move away from our actual location up to 300, 400, 500 yards or more. Then, all of a sudden it will correct itself and show us back on the hi-way we currently on but then we'll notice that we are a couple hundred yards further up the road than it is showing. On longer runs it seems to get worse (as in distance being off) but then it will correct itself (well sort of). The dealer is convinced (from talking to Ford) that issue lies with the snow tire set up the dealer put on the vehicle (we got a set of winter wheels and tires as part of the promotion when we purchased the vehicle). The dealer just this afternoon started to look for a different winter tire that closer match the summer set up that came with the car. Now, the issue with winter set up is being blamed on the circumference difference of tires and the interaction between the GPS and the rotation of the wheels. I've got to admit I very skeptical on this being the issue since the GPS should be getting the vehicle's coordinates solely on the satellites. But I’m sure if Ford has done something funky with MyTouch. Anyway, I was wondering if anyone else was having issues with the GPS not correctly calculating the vehicle’s current location. (I don’t mean 10-50 yards consistently which would be a simple calibration issues, but large variations in the same position calculations).

 

What is interesting is turning on breadcrumbs and seeing the various routes the system thinks you have taken when in fact they were same.

 

BTW I drive BMW F10 with built-in navigation and it is not without issues – but they are all related to outdated maps and poor directional logic…it always reports the exact location the vehicle is at, it just told you a really bad of getting there :whew: .

 

My $99 TomTom works best of all.

[mv-clear]

Seems to be a common problem, mine shows be in the bush every once while, usually it corrects itself in a few mins. Waiting for the new A4 card to upgrade MTF to the newer version, hopefully it will correct that problem.

 

MV

[Waldo]

It could be that your GPS antenna is not working. Have you tried using Sync services? That uses the same GPS antenna but different software, so if it has a problem, then you know it's the GPS. If the nav system isn't getting a reliable GPS signal, it will attempt to calculate where you are based on the distance traveled (this is where tire diameter will make a difference) and the steering wheel angle. That's not a new feature, Ford's nav systems have always done that. Then when it picks up a GPS signal again, it will jump back to where the GPS says you are.

 

By the way if your dealer is giving you snow tires that are not the same diameter as the stock tires, they should be shot! Smaller diameter tires usually mean lower load ratings. If you're running a lower load rating than the OE tires, you are at a much greater risk of a blowout. Never mind that you're "cheating" the mileage - your odometer will end up with fewer miles than you've actually traveled.

[Dingo]

The odometer will actually have more miles than traveled. More rotations for the same distance...

[Sharbotcom]

My conlusion is that the antenna is giving us the grief also. The snow tires are within toleance (I can't remember the difference but it is very minute). The dealer is convinced that is th issue. But I'm with waldo, a GPS is a GPS and that means it should be getting its signal from the satelites. I now understand why Ford would utilize distance/direction feeds from the wheels to "estimate" location when it can't get a proper sighting of enough satlites (like when traveling between many tall buildings, going through tunnels, etc. But this is kicking in when we are driving on an open hiway. So, it has to be the antenna is failing. So, now we will get new snow tires from Ford and be back in a week to get a new antenna...

 

BTW Thanks all for the replies.

Edited January 16, 2013 by Sharbotcom

[Sharbotcom]

UPDATE #1

 

a) The dealer (and I) have confirmed the snow tire size is within specs so that has been ruled out.

I did the test for the number of satellites the system sees and it was varying from 8 to 11 which is good..

 

 

The dealer has asked for the Edge to be brought back in for more "tests". If the antenna is fine and the wheels are fine and generally all the other vehicle with MFT are working as expected then the only conclusion I can come to is our unit is faulty.

 

BTW we have the latest update.

 

I'll keep the forum posted but if anyone else has had the same issue in the past and Ford was able to solve it, please let me know.

 

Thanks,

Bill

Edited January 19, 2013 by Sharbotcom

[ls973800]

I have a 2013 Edge Limited I purchased in July 2012, built in May, 2012. The navigation has been spot on and never shows me off the road I am on and never places me ahead or behind by more than a few feet.

 

I have read numerous complaints from 2013 Ford Escape owner's who are reporting the same problems as you are. Since there are so many reports from them (on the Sync My Ride Community Board http://boards.synccommunity.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?tsn=1&nav=messages&webtag=fordsyncmb&tid=5793) there has to have been a change in the components being put into these navs. I wonder if a different supplier is providing some of the new parts for the Escape, and if maybe some of those same parts are being put into later build Edges?

 

Just a thought, but you are not the only nav owner with those same problems, although as I said the majority seem to be 2013 Escape owners.

Edited January 19, 2013 by ls973800

[ls973800]

Oh, doing some more reading over there on the Sync site and it's also happening to other models.

[Sparkey]

I purchased an 2013 Edge Limited about 3 months ago and had this exact problem with the GPS from the start.

After several unsucessfull attempts a resolving this issue ( ex. new maps, new firmware twice ) they reported that

they had a solution from Ford . The units apparently wind up locked onto incorrect sattelites and don't get flushed out

of memory. ( I assume sattelites that are far too away from present location as it looks like a reception problem )

The Fix is to do what they reffered to as a Master Reset ( not a firmware reset ). Simply this is with the vehicle

placed outside in an open area ( to the sky ) disconnect the battery for about an hour. This flushes that part of

memory in the GPS. When the battery is reattached and the unit is turned back on it is forced to pick up the new

sattelites.

This was done on my Edge over 2 weeks ago and has been working perfectly ever since.

 

I know that this will lead to the question, Why doesn't the GPS just pick up the better sattelites automatically?

I will make a guess. Part 1: Because the vehicles were made in a different location and were shipped to their new homes

they could be on those original sat's. Part 2: If the firmware tries to prevent hunting for new sattelites in the event of loss

of signal strength from all the sattelites in memory ( driving through a tunnel or bridge or underground parking ) as opposed to one

or two sattelites losing signal strength ( normal driving situation ). This way the GPs could still show approximately where you are on the maps when driving through a long tunnel , by using vehicle speed and road road to determine.

 

Once again this is my guess as to what is happening. I do know that mine is now working flawlessly within my 100 mile

radius. And will not know more until I do a long trip.

 

Hope this will help people out

[Edgieguy]

Continue to document and visit the dealer with these problems as most lemon laws require only 3 visits with the same problem being unresolved as a trigger for further action. That further action can be as extreme as a full buyback at original cost to refunds in the thousands of dollars. Best of all, all lemon lawyers fees are paid by the manufacturer so as not to re-victimize the consumer who purchased the defective vehicle.

[Sharbotcom]

I purchased an 2013 Edge Limited about 3 months ago and had this exact problem with the GPS from the start.

After several unsucessfull attempts a resolving this issue ( ex. new maps, new firmware twice ) they reported that

they had a solution from Ford . The units apparently wind up locked onto incorrect sattelites and don't get flushed out

of memory. ( I assume sattelites that are far too away from present location as it looks like a reception problem )

The Fix is to do what they reffered to as a Master Reset ( not a firmware reset ). Simply this is with the vehicle

placed outside in an open area ( to the sky ) disconnect the battery for about an hour. This flushes that part of

memory in the GPS. When the battery is reattached and the unit is turned back on it is forced to pick up the new

sattelites.

This was done on my Edge over 2 weeks ago and has been working perfectly ever since.

 

I know that this will lead to the question, Why doesn't the GPS just pick up the better sattelites automatically?

I will make a guess. Part 1: Because the vehicles were made in a different location and were shipped to their new homes

they could be on those original sat's. Part 2: If the firmware tries to prevent hunting for new sattelites in the event of loss

of signal strength from all the sattelites in memory ( driving through a tunnel or bridge or underground parking ) as opposed to one

or two sattelites losing signal strength ( normal driving situation ). This way the GPs could still show approximately where you are on the maps when driving through a long tunnel , by using vehicle speed and road road to determine.

 

Once again this is my guess as to what is happening. I do know that mine is now working flawlessly within my 100 mile

radius. And will not know more until I do a long trip.

 

Hope this will help people out

Thanks Sparkey. I'm hoping your solution works for us. Would you mind sharing which dealer you use? It sounds like they are much more on the ball than the one I'm using.

Bill

[Sharbotcom]

UPDATE# 2

 

We had the vehicle into the dealer yesterday to have the battery pull and master reset. I have to say we've put on over 240km (150 miles) since the reset and all is working so far (thanks again sparkey). What is interesting is that the phones did not need to be re-paired.

 

Thanks everyone, I'll update if things change.

 

Bill

[Sparkey]

Glad to here it worked for you. This seem to be to solution for the majority of these reception issues.

 

 

Peter