TPMS on summers didn't need retraining

[AXCL]

Has anyone else experienced this? I believe I've read a few posts somewhere that the odd person didn't have to setup their TPMS after putting their summer tires back on. I just had service done on the weekend and had my summers installed, but the dealer told me they couldn't reprogram the TPMS because a tech had just dropped their only reset too and that I'd have to come back during the week. They did tell me, they may retrain them automatically. I have a hard time believing some don't need retraining, while others do. This feature either exists, or it doesn't.

 

We'll I've now driven 80+KM and have yet to get a warning light. If I would have known this, I would have just changed them myself weeks ago.

 

Its one of those things that now since I'm not getting an error, I'm worried about how well its working, as to my understanding, it isn't supposed to be working.

 

Do the 11'+ Edge's support 8 TPMS sensors? I've never understood why this wouldn't be standard on all TPMS vehicles in the first place. Many vehicles do support it, but from what I've read, officially the Edge isn't supposed to have this feature.

 

What I find more confusing is that I had one of my winters go flat in my driveway just after I bought the Edge, I put one summer on just to drive to have it patched. During that 2km drive, it did show the TPMS warning. The tire had been changed before it lost much air and the vehicle wasn't even running when it was low, so it must have been an issue reading the sensor, so if this feature does work, this would make it seem like it remembers 2 sets of sensors. Unless they are used as a set, it doesn't pickup just one odd sensor.

 

I have no clue, all of the above is just speculation, but somebody must know the facts on how the Edge is supposed to work with TPMS.

Edited May 7, 2012 by AXCL

[Theakerr]

I have a 2010 and have never understood the "re-training" theory. I put my summer tires on, the low pressure light comes on, I drive about 1/4 mile it goes off. End of story. I suppose some people might call this learning. What does surprise me is that it takes about 30 km to activate when I put on my winter tires that do not have a sensor. Last year the tire sensor did activate when one tire went down.

[Waldo]

Two separate situations in these two posts.

 

First to Theakerr, if you're winter tires don't have sensors, then your car is not learning anything. When you put on the winters it takes a while for it to recognize that the sensors are not there. This is done intentionally so that interference and such that could cause it to miss signals doesn't trigger your warning all the time. But it never forgets the original sensors, so when you put on your summers's again, it just finds them again and is happy.

 

Now to AXCL, there is no "second set" of sensors in the system. But what's odd is that over on the Fusion forum, a bunch of other Canadians have noted that they can change to winter tires and it will automatically learn the new sensors, while Americans who try the same thing do not have success. I was told by a real Ford TPMS engineer that even the US systems can automatically learn just one new sensor, but maybe the Canadian ones are programmed to learn all 4 new ones. This seems at least partly plausible since TPMS is not federally regulated in Canada and Canadians are far more likely to use winter tires.

[slypx]

I, for one, last fall, put up my winter tires on with new rims and 4 Ford original new sensors last October and never had to deal with programming them. I was ready for it, I had bought the programmer for it.

 

2 weeks ago, had the summer chrome clad wheels put back on and no reprogramming at all ...

 

The learning process seems automatic each times.

 

PS : Never heard about the "Canadian theory" of the TPMS, but I've got a Canadian 2011 Edge limited and living in Canada (Montreal area)

Edited May 8, 2012 by slypx

[factor99]

I put on winters with tirerack sensors last fall and they enrolled themselves in my 2011 Canadian Edge. Went back to the stock wheels this spriing with no problems..

[richy]

I had the weirdest experience with changing over to my winters and back. I did not put TPM in the winters and only rarely did I ever get a warning message about it. I have had no warnings since putting the summers back on and they appear to be working fine. I checked the pressure on them prior to re-installing them anyway, so it's not like I'd get a message. So, it appears they are working correctly with the original wheels/tires.

[AXCL]

Now to AXCL, there is no "second set" of sensors in the system. ...

 

I didn't mean their were 2 sets of sensors, just that the system remembered 2 sets of codes i.e 8 codes (winter and summer tires) instead of just 4. To me, this would make sence and does exist, but based on some peoples experience, the system seems to be able to learn brand new sensors that have not yet been programmed. This may point to the fact that it doesn't remember any sensors. Perhaps it just needs to detect 4 sensors. If we're luckly, the system is smart enough to go into learning mode when it doesn't detect any of its original 4 sensors and once it picks up 4 it keeps them until it loses connection. This would prevent picking up rogue signals. It could also be the monkeys in the wheels pressed the right button at the right time. We won't know for sure unless someone from Ford can confirm any of this.

 

I had the weirdest experience with changing over to my winters and back. I did not put TPM in the winters and only rarely did I ever get a warning message about it. I have had no warnings since putting the summers back on and they appear to be working fine. I checked the pressure on them prior to re-installing them anyway, so it's not like I'd get a message. So, it appears they are working correctly with the original wheels/tires.

 

If you say you rarely were getting the warning message even without TPM installed, then it makes me concirned as to how well this system actually works. There was another user who said the were not getting errors as their summers were in the garage next to the vechile, so on startup, they may have been detected. Once the summers were moved to a back shed, they started getting the warning light. I'm assuming with your detailing, you've got your MKX in the garage close to your summers. If my comment above has any merrit, perhaps you could also have been picking up rogue codes from other vehicles. I wonder if this added to your lack of errors.

 

I guess the only way to know for sure that they are working is to drop the pressure in one of the tires and go for a short ride.

Edited May 9, 2012 by AXCL

[Waldo]

I didn't mean their were 2 sets of sensors, just that the system remembered 2 sets of codes i.e 8 codes (winter and summer tires) instead of just 4. To me, this would make sence and does exist, but based on some peoples experience, the system seems to be able to learn brand new sensors that have not yet been programmed. This may point to the fact that it doesn't remember any sensors. Perhaps it just needs to detect 4 sensors. If we're luckly, the system is smart enough to go into learning mode when it doesn't detect any of its original 4 sensors and once it picks up 4 it keeps them until it loses connection. This would prevent picking up rogue signals. It could also be the monkeys in the wheels pressed the right button at the right time. We won't know for sure unless someone from Ford can confirm any of this.

 

 

It remembers sensors. What most people don't realize is that while driving, the sensors are not continuously broadcasting. They only send out a signal about once every 2 minutes. If you're driving in heavy traffic, the car is probably picking up TPMS signals from all the other cars around, it could see 10 or even 20 signals from other cars before it sees it's own signal again. That's why it takes so long to set a fault when there are no sensors, because it's counting to probably 10 instances of not getting the signal it expects, but that could take 20 minutes!

 

As I said, I know for a fact that the system will learn one new sensor if it picks up the other three. I also know for a fact that US vehicles will not learn all 4 new sensors at once. The only thing I don't know is if the Canadian vehicles have the ability to learn 4 new sensors. There is no unique Canadian documentation in the service manuals, they all just say that new sensors must be trained.

[richy]

My summers were downstairs in the basement and nowhere near the proximity of the winters, so that was not the case. You're right, the only sure way to tell would be to deliberately drop one down low and see if/how long it took to pick up the signal. Another task for my lengthy to-do list, LOL.

[Dingo]

This is why I like the south. We don't have "summers" and "winters." We simply have "wheels."

[AXCL]

As I said, I know for a fact that the system will learn one new sensor if it picks up the other three. I also know for a fact that US vehicles will not learn all 4 new sensors at once.

 

So I guess US vehicles could change one tire at a time and go for a short drive between each one...PITA, but it would work.

 

Dingo - Ahhh...what it would be like to just own "wheels".

 

Richy - I hear ya re: To Do List (not to mention the Honey Do List) P.S. I like the new website...well not sure how new it is, but I've not noticed it in your signature until a couple of days ago. I hope it helps rake in the biz for ya!

[richy]

So I guess US vehicles could change one tire at a time and go for a short drive between each one...PITA, but it would work.

 

Dingo - Ahhh...what it would be like to just own "wheels".

 

Richy - I hear ya re: To Do List (not to mention the Honey Do List) P.S. I like the new website...well not sure how new it is, but I've not noticed it in your signature until a couple of days ago. I hope it helps rake in the biz for ya!

 

Thanks bud! It is only weeks old. The last step is to get a LOGO in place and I'm working on that now.