DGW

Just had the torque converter replaced at 48,000 mile on my 2019 Edge. Thankfully I had the Ford ESP to cover the costs. I always had the surge/buck just under 20 mph with the Edge cold from sitting over night driving out of my neighborhood but that would go away as the engine and transmission warmed up. This was different. The shuttering would be as accelerating and would be at the shift points. It was constant even after the Edge warmed up. One thing that concerns me is that as the OP is asking I do not think there was a redesign of the torque converter so I wonder if it will happen again in another 40,000 miles. I looked up the part number for the torque converter and the list of models Ford uses the exact same torque converter on is long. Once the ESP expires in 2 years I will probably trade the Edge for something else. As a side note I just put new tires on the Edge about 2 weeks ago at a cost of over $1,500 so I made the dealer check the wheel alignment after all of the messing with the front end and sure enough the alignment needed to be tweaked.

Mine was built at the end of 2019. I think that the last update I had was May 2021 but I would have to go back to my dealer paper work to be sure. I do not have ForScan. I really do think that skipping the 2nd gear would go a long way in addressing the issue. That is what really interested me about your post. I wonder if Ford has made any additional software updates since 2021. I will have to go back to my dealer's service writer and ask if he can tell if I have the latest software version.

Do you own an EDGE ST? I believe that is the only version of the Edge where the 8F35 transmission was changed to a 7 speed transmission through the software. If not when was the last software update that you received that changed the 8F35 to a 7 speed transmission? I was not aware that Ford had eliminated the 2nd gear in the other Edge trims. Is there any place to actually look up the different transmission updates, when they came out and what they did? If the update that allowed the transmission to skip the 2nd gear is still only for the ST line version the dealer will not be able to update my Titanium with that update unless Ford made an update for the other trims that incorporated the skipping of the 2nd gear.

Should that even happen I would assume since under warranty the dealer would have to convince Ford to approve the repair. Additionally the "new" transmission would most likely be a rebuilt transmission with the latest software version. I believe only brand new cars that are less than a year old would actually receive a brand new transmission. I personally do not think a new transmission would matter unless the engineers actually changed something in the transmission that is different from yours. I think that is highly unlikely as I previously mentioned my 2024 Bronco Sport has the same issue and I assume the 24 models would have the latest version of the transmission assuming any changes were made. It may take that class action law suit that you referenced for Ford to come up with a solution that works.

I know this issue is very frustrating and even though it happens to many Ford models and different model years I still do not consider it "normal". I originally posted about my 2019 Edge surging/bucking at low speed which only happens when the engine/transmission was cold. (page 8: August 9, 2021). It still happens today. As always, in my case it seems to happen in the summer months when the outside temperatures are in the 90's. The issue goes away after a few minutes once I am out of my neighborhood and the Edge has warmed up. It may happen other times with cooler temperatures but not as severe. Early on there have been TSB's from Ford on the issue but as others have mentioned refreshing the transmission with the latest software did not help. I have a 20 Escape where the issue has also happened but not to the same extent as my Edge and more recently I just purchased a new 2024 Bronco Sport with the same transmission and 2.0L engine and on very hot days I have experienced the same surging/bucking issue at low speed when starting to drive off from a cold start in the neighborhood. Based on my experience of initially having the Dealer trying to flash the transmission software as Ford recommended and now having 3 Ford models manufactured in different years this is an engineering issue and will not get fixed by throwing parts at the cars. I do not know about the EGR valve where some on the forum has resolved the issue. Their surging/bucking might be different than what I experience and especially with it happening to my brand new BS I doubt it would help me. So bottom line is I do not know that there is a fix for this. Ford obviously is no longer trying to find a fix and there are many posts on the internet of others having the issue with other Ford models besides the Edge. I currently have over 40,000 miles since new on my Edge and the issue is still there but has not gotten worse. At this point I try to ignore the surging/bucking and consider it a quirk of the vehicle that happens under certain conditions and only lasts for a few minutes until I am out of the neighborhood and the car warms up. While I know this is not really an answer, as a precaution I purchased the Ford ESP plan in case the issue gets worse.

Ok, so we are probably talking about more than one surge/bucking issue on this thread and based on your comment the EGR will not fix the issue I am having with my Ford's which is surging only when the cars are cold as I am driving out of my neighborhood below 20 mph. I can keep the rpm's at 1500 with the car in neutral. Once out of the neighborhood and on the roads which are generally 45 mph the cars act normally and the issue does not reappear until the car has sat long enough for the engine/transmission to be cold again. As the dealer said there is nothing more they can do for me. It is just the way the transmissions are and having 3 different Ford models with the same issue and one of them being brand new I would have to agree it is normal as far as Ford is concerned. That said I do not believe that the issue is normal but as long as it is not (in my case) getting worse there is nothing Ford is going to do.

Yes, my 20 Escape and brand new 24 Bronco Sport have both exhibited the same issue which for me is starting out with car engine/transmission cold and outside temperature is warm. Worse with temperature in the 90's. All vehicles have the same 2.0L engine and the same 8-speed 8F35 transmission. As Toby99 said I have been told that Ford decided that it is normal for the transmission since the software flashing did not work. I am a bit skeptical that replacing the DPFE sensor is a the fix that we have all been waiting for since I felt the issue in my Bronco Sport which only has a 1000 miles on it.

I believe EGR is covered under the emissions warranty which for most emission items is 2/24000. Not sure if emission coverage is extended through Ford ESP extended plan.

I have had the issue since the car was new. The Dealer flashed the software several times but other than that nothing else. I believe it is just a characteristic of the transmission. I also have a 20 escape with the same transmission and it does essentially the same thing but not as intense as the Edge. In my case the bucking surging only happens in warmer weather and only lasts when I first start out with the Edge for a short time and goes away after the transmission is warmed up. The Dealer is very aware of the issue but has basically said it is "normal" in the sense that there is nothing that they can do about it.

When you were getting the surge/buck over the winter was it only when the Edge was cold? That is what mine does. Only surge/buck with the engine cold. It mostly happened as the outside temperatures got hot but I am getting it now as the temperatures are cooling off. Don't remember that happening before. Also only happens when car is cold so the dealer would not be able to duplicate the surge/buck unless I left over night. Did your surge/buck become more constant in February?

How about throwing some oil trace dye into the oil so that it works it's way through and hopefully will show up under UV light. When I have had oil leaks in the past I asked the dealer to put the dye in and brought the car back a few days later to be repaired. I hate waiting time and having to make multiple trips for repairs.

I agree, the torque converter/valve body fix may be the answer. I am still under the 50K power train warranty and I do have the Ford ESP for 8 years/100K so coverage shouldn't be a problem as long as the dealer is willing to fix the issue replacing the torque converter. The first issue is getting the dealer to actually verify the issue. Since in my case the bucking/surging goes away after the car has warmed up I would have to leave the car overnight at the dealer so the issue can be verified before it is serviced and in my case it seems to be worst during high outside temps (high 80's and above) so I would have to watch the weather. My bucking/surging came back after not having an issue for a couple of years during the heat wave of the last couple of weeks here in NJ. Because there was a software update available the dealer did the update without actually verifying the issue because the car was warm. They noted that in the invoice as the reason they could not verify the issue which makes me believe that Ford is aware that the issue is primarily an issue of cold starts. The second issue is getting Ford to approve the repair. At this point I do not believe there is a TSB communication regarding the torque converter and while bp_2019EdgeTi thinks replacing the torque converter may have fixed the issue. I am hoping he is right. We don't know if this was something his dealer decided to do on their own or Ford Engineering was involved and knows something that has not been published. I know that there are times when the dealer doesn't know what to do to fix an issue and they contact Ford Engineering for assistance. The last TSP on the issue was the 21-2389 in November 2021 and that only talked about a software update. Another question for Ford is what happened after the built before date of March 21 mentioned in the TSB? Did Ford update the software and call it a day on the issue or was something more extensive done like some type of redesign? I am guessing issues persisted after the software update based on responses on this thread and my own experience and Ford doesn't want to do an expensive repair except in the worst cases. I apologize for the long winded comments. Just trying to get everything in the post that I was thinking including not being easy to get Ford to pay for an extensive repair. I will make a copy of the invoice for the torque converter repair and show it to the Dealer to see what they say.

As HAZ said above 21-2389 is the latest TSB regarding the low speed bucking/surging. In my case it is really noticeable when the engine is cold like sitting overnight or sitting for a few hours. The TSB discusses a PCM update that should definitely be covered under the 36K warranty. I would bring the Edge in before the 36K warranty expires to at least talk to the service advisor about the issue. In my case I am out of the 36K warranty period but just had the update done about two weeks ago and it was covered under the 50K powertrain warranty. In my case I did not have the car sitting overnight and because the engine/transmission was warm the dealer did not bother to test drive first but verified that there was a PCM update and performed the update. Didn't really stop the problem but as the temperatures have cooled a bit the bucking/surging has been at a minimum.

I have had a 2010 and 2016 Fusions before getting the Edge. They were both very comfortable cars and I was really sad to see them discontinued. I just happened to be speaking to my service advisor this morning and the Edge being discontinued and he mentioned he recalls a lot of customers at the time who drove sedans going to other brands. He said he hasn't seen those customers since. I imagine Ford will see some loyal customers not return after the Edge is discontinued and I am guessing that to Ford it will be just a cost of doing business.

I love my 2019 Edge and when ready to buy again would replace it with another Edge in a heart beat. Unfortunately Ford is discontinuing the Edge after the 2024 model year and Ford Authority is saying they will be producing an EV Explorer at the plant. For me the Edge was the perfect size if wanting something larger than an Escape and but not wanting to go up to the size of an Explorer. At least for me I think that Ford is making a mistake by discontinuing the Edge as it filled a space between the Escape and the Explorer. For anyone thinking about replacing their Edge in the future what are you thinking? Will you buy a different Ford model even though it may not be similar to the Edge in size or would you consider buying another brand? I am in the process of buying a 23 Escape to replace my wife's Escape so not in the market today to replace the Edge. While I understand that Ford is focusing on EV's I am not ready for buying one and may me forced to purchase another brand.

So after about a week of having the PCM updated again I can say the the bucking is still there at low speeds especially driving out of the neighborhood. Primarily this is first drive of the day after the car has sat overnight. As the car warms up the bucking goes away. I do believe the hot weather brought the bucking back (over 90 degrees during the day and warn nights so the closed garage was still hot in the morning. Does anyone else feel the issue is worse during hot weather or have you been experiencing the bucking/surging regardless of the outside temerature?

Is the latest TSB 21-2389 from 11/2021? Interestingly I was just discussing the issue on a Ford Escape forum because someone was complaining about a similar issue and I have experienced this issue on my 2019 edge and 2020 Escape. In replying to my comment on the forum someone mentioned that Ford got creative with the 2023 ST Line Edge by turning the transmission into a 7 speed transmission by eliminating the second gear through software changes to the transmission. Couldn't find anywhere if the ST Line Transmission is the identical 8F35 transmission but with software changes. If the ST Line 7 speed transmission does not have the same issue then it makes you wonder if Ford can use software to do the same to the 8F35 that we have or it was updated to a 7 speed transmission for other reasons. Just thinking out loud. Smarter people than me might know why. Also thinking that assuming eliminating the second gear through software works for this situation it might cause legal issues for Ford since we purchased a vehicle with an eight speed transmission. I am back on this thread because I just had the Edge PCM updated again because the issue returned and wanted to see how others are doing with the issue. Maybe my imagination but I have felt that the outside temperature has had something to do with the intensity of the bucking. The last few days have been humid and in the 90's. Maybe just a coincidence.

Thank you.

The battery was replaced just at the end of the 3 year warranty by the Dealer. They had tested the battery at that time and it did show that it was low so they replaced free of charge. The battery is now about 7 months old so I doubt the battery is an issue but will have the dealer check it the next time I am there. I tried searching for SSM 51725 online to print out but could not find it. I will take a screen shot in the team time. While searching for the SSM I saw on another tread in a different Ford Forum (Maverick I think) that someone had SSM 51725 completed and di don't fix their issue. Another person mentioned that they updated the Ford Pass app and that seemed to fix their problem. I checked and there was an update to Ford pass on the Apple App Store that was a day old so installed it. I just tried the remote start again and it worked as well as unlock and lock doors. I did not get the deep sleep message this time so I will print out the SSM and save it for future reference. Thank you everyone for your help and insight. These forums are a valuable source of help.

Update: After searching the internet for more info on the issue I came across something on the Ford website for issues with correct location not showing. part of the suggested fix was to verify that remote start worked from the app. So I tried the remote start and it did start the car and the unlock and lock doors feature also worked. Than got a strange message that car is in deep sleep and will only start manually. Got into car and started it up and the Ford Pass app updated to current information, onboard modem serial number was now showing and I was able to access the connectivity settings.

Hi ebank, did the modem going out affect the Ford pass connectivity and not being able to see vehicle information in Ford pass?

I have a 2019 Edge. I just received a dashboard notice that I need an oil change. I went to the Ford Pass app and noticed that it was showing 70% oil life because it had not updated since October 2022. I called Ford primarily to verify that I had 4g connectivity and in discussing the issues that I am having with Ford pass connectivity she said she just had a similar issue with another customer and determined that in order to have connectivity to the Ford Pass app I have to have the navigation subscription. Not sure what one has to do with the other but has anyone else come across this issue and found that the Nav subscription is the problem?

Follow up to my initial question regarding mixed mode audio presets. I tried doing a master reset. That did nothing regarding how the radio operated and surprisingly still allowed me to receive SiriusXM without refreshing the signal. I finally called Ford Company and was ultimately told that there was a couple of different displays for sync 3.4 depending on the radio but ultimately was told to have the dealer check out the issue because the software and hardware seemed to be identical on my two vehicles. The Ford Representative said I should also call SiriusXM to verify that I am properly activated. I called SiriusXM and was transferred to Technical support and this is where I found out the radios on the 20 Escape and 19 Edge are actually different and will not operate exactly the same. The 20 Escape has a newer SiriusXM platform X65 which allows for the mixed mode audio presets. It also can receive additional channels that the Edge cannot. It is also why the Escape can have up to 6 preset pages while the Edge only has 3 that I cannot change or why the Edge does not show album covers while playing a song. I suspected that the different vehicle models had something to do with the reason why the two radios acted differently. At least I finally got an answer that made sense and now understand that the radios are just different.

Thank you enigma-2. I will look into that. It sounds like that is a possible solution.

I have a 2019 Ford Edge and a 2020 Ford Escape. Both have the exact same Sync 3.4 build (version 3.4, build 21194) but the way the radio station presets work is different. On the Escape I have multiple radio sources ( AM, FM, satellite radio) on the same line of presets. It does not change regardless of the source selected. On the Edge I cannot get the presets fro the various sources to show up on the same row of presets. Pushing the source button changes the presets and they only show presets for that source. Even though the Sync builds are exactly the same does the specific ford model change the way Sync works or am I missing something in the way I am setting up the presets on the Edge? I tried following a Ford video showing how to set up the presets for mixed-mode audio presets but cannot get it to work. Here is a link to the Ford video: https://youtu.be/J6-VBjdbKh0