bb56

Latest: Local mechanic will do it for $2200. He's done a lot of them he says.Unfortunately, He charges Ford list price for the parts ($1250 for PTU and $190 for intermediate shaft) when I could get them on-line for $900 and $128). But I know I don't want to do a job like this on the floor of my garage so I told him to go ahead. It's $1100 less than ford and he does good work. He has a caveat: 'as long as everything goes right since they have to remove the CAT and such. I already replaced the Y pipe 4 months ago so those should come off easily but the CAT to manifold and the O2 sensor I assume are the only real risks. Anything else?

Thanks @enigma-2 When I took the driveshaft to the driveline shop, they told me that you can't separate the two halves of the driveshaft on this car as they are welded after the center bearing is put on. There is no bolt to hold the two halves together. Luckily, the rubber and bearing are good at this time because they said I'd have to replace the driveshaft if it goes. The $1400 was an off-the cuff estimate. He says he does a lot of these but I will be getting a formal quote later in the week. He said he uses nothing but Ford parts but I will ask about new versus rebuilt. I don't think Ford deals in rebuilt parts but could be mistaken. I can't believe it is in the front intermediate shaft because it seems very clear it is coming from the rear. I'll update when I know more.

Does anyone know if the intermediate shaft bearing on my 2011 AWD Limited can be changed? I've been looking for info on changing the shaft itself, but I haven't found anything. I am thinking of replacing it and wondered if I need to get the PTU seal kit even though it is not leaking. Has anyone done this?

UPDATE: I went to the ford dealer for diagnosis. They said it is the intermediate shaft bearing and since the PTU had oil stains on it, they want to replace the PTU as well. Four years ago, the PTU pushed out the black goo from the vent and made a mess under there. I cleaned up the spots in the garage, then did a drain and fill. There was a lot of pasty sludge and eventually the suction hose got clogged. I was able to put about 4-5 ounces in after that. I've been driving since then with no leaks. I put chassis ears on the PTU and didn't really hear anything abnormal, but I never put it on the intermediate shaft bearing. The dealer quoted me $3,100 to change the PTU and intermediate shaft. Two years ago, the same dealer quoted me $1600 for the PTU. So I went to my local mechanic who also gave me a quote of $1450 back then. He told me to check with Ford again because they extended the warranty and I may be covered. I went back to Ford and they said it was by VIN only and my car wasn't on the list. I suspect that it is only the intermediate shaft bearing but the dealer wants to change the PTU anyway. But since my local quy told me it would be around $1400 still, I'll probably just do it so I can stop worrying about it.

I've looked for codes using Forscan and also a different OBD blue-tooth app. I didn't find any. The weirdest thing I found so far was pulling off the right rear bearing (which I replaced 3 months ago) and it has a small bit of noise in it. I put in a Timken bearing thinking it's one of the best, but I used my "chassisEar" type microphone pickup on that wheel knuckle and that's where I hear the most noise from. Given that the noise was there before and after replacing it, I don't think it is the bearing again, but I'm really scratching my head over this. That brake caliper was replaced because the original one failed but I can't remember if it was coincident with the noise starting. I checked out the caliper when I pulled the bearing yesterday and it still looks and operated like new. so I'm eliminating it as a suspect. I also hung the mic on the center bearing in the driveshaft but did not hear anything noteworthy. The driveshaft feels tight but I'll go at it again with a pry bar to see if there is any play in the universals. I'll also change the PTU fluid while I'm under there. I changed it about 15k miles ago and it was pretty gunked up but now it seems to be more fluid and maybe I can get more old gunk out with this change. If the sound changes at all, I'll suspect the PTU even though I can't hear it on the mic.

I do live in a rustbelt state - Massachusetts - and the bearing looked like yours when I pulled it out. It took 15 minutes to get the bearing out once I got the 4 main bolts off that hiold it on. The secret, for those who don't know is using what I call the "bolt press" technique. Cut off one of the lug bolts about 1/4" from the hub and push it through - hammer it through actually. Remove one of the backing plate screws (I used the one on top) by using a 1/4" drive 8 mm socket on a small extension after aligning the missing lug hole over it. The 1/4" socket fits neatly thru the hole and the bolt removes with only a little persuasion. Place a small piece of metal over the backing plate hole that is left and push a 1/2" x 3" bolt through the lug hole, thread on a nut under the hub, and hand tighten until the bolt is wedged between the small piece of metal (resting on the backing plate to protect it) and the hub. Start turning the bolt which will press the hub outward. When it first starts to open, hit the hub on the opposite side with a hammer then continue to tighten the bolt. Do this a few times and the bearing will be out before you realize it. I saw this technique here When I did the other side 3 months ago, it was taking me a half a day and still made no progress - slide hammer and all. After I saw the video, it was out in 10 minutes. This trick really works! Now back to my original issue - the noise is still there. I've replaced all 4 wheel bearings (the last two were a bit noisy), and one front axle. I don't know if the center bearing in the drive shaft would "thrum" in time with wheel rotation, but I'll inspect it closer next. What else could b making the noise - all ideas welcome.

It's a good thought. @enigma-2 My tires are Cooper RTS (Formerly CTS) with about 9/32" or more tread and look like new. I've also rotated them with no appreciable difference in noise level. I don't drive that much so these tires probably have less than 20K mi on them. The noise has been going on for 2 years or so. I had to replace one of the rear tires last year when I ran over a garden rake that fell in my garage. The tire was like new and it broke my heart. Again, no change in noise. I've replaced 3 out of four wheel bearings. The last change was front left and when I took off the knuckle and rotated the hub, I was surprise at how noisy it was. Unfortunately my chassisEAR mic didn't pick up anything out of the ordinary. And true to that finding, the noise is still there after replacing that bearing. My next thought is to just replace the rear drivers sde bearing since I didn't hear the front bearing noises, maybe it will turn out to be the source. Only another $100 to find out (and 3 hours of separating the old rusty one). I've been putting in Timken bearings rather than the $50 ebay knockoffs. Thanks for the reply.

This happened in my 2011 Limited on two occasions. Once when I broke the rear wheel sensor as I changed out the wheel bearing. I had to wait 3 days for a new one but after putting it in, it took a few minutes for the lights to go out. But the car did drive fine for the 3 days. The other occasion was when I pulled the ABS fuse and turned off traction control using the left hand system menu. I had pulled the wheels and had the car on jack stands so I could troubleshoot a wheel noise and there was some pretty loud thunk/banging noises until I pulled the fuse and turned off traction control. These lights came on. I put the fuse in after putting th wheels back on and turned on Traction control and started the car. Lights went out. So it's possible you have a bad wheel sensor (or a tone ring broke and fell off the axle, or maybe the traction control setting in the systems menu got turned off somehow. I think Forscan will show any codes if you have it. With any luck, it's just a bad/loose/corroded fuse in the fusebox under the hood. It seems intermittent enough . Hope this helps you track down the problem.

I've been getting a thum-thum type noise that corresponds to wheel speed for about 2 years. It seems to be coming from the rear. At first I thought it was an out of round tire from the type of noise it made. I rotated tires making no difference. I've checked wheel bearings both manually and by doing side-to-side turns at 30 mph (noise is most easily heard at that speed). No luck. I put the car up on jackstands took off the tires and disabled the anti-lock brakes by pulling the fuse (must do this otherwise they try to engage) and had a friend accelerate to 30mph whil I circled the car with a steel rod to my ear to probe suspected spots. He could hear it but I couldn't isolate it to front or rear. Too much other noise. The front right axle looked like it was wobbling a little so I replaced it and the wheel bearing since I had it and was in there. No luck. Noise is the same. Since it felt like it was coming the right rear when I drive it, I replaced that wheel bearing - very rusted-in but found a neat trick of pushing out a stud and using another bolt to press against the knuckle finally worked. However, that didn't fix the problem either. I built a chassisEAR clip from a surplus peizo transducer glued to a battery clip. I plugged it into my phone's audio jack and used the voice recorder app to collect the sound. Since it was a single microphone clip I made multiple runs attached in different places including the front left wheel knuckle, the PTU, the transmission, the left and right rear wheel knuckles and lower arms plus 2 different spots on the rear diff casing. I ran each audio clip through audacity low pass filter of 300 HZ. The noise was the most prominent at the right rear wheel knuckle although I can hear it in the left rear knuckle too. It's even less audible in the differential. The interesting thing is that I have a new hub and bearing in the right rear and the noise didn't change when I replaced it. Yesterday, I reached up and grabbed the rear axles. I could move the axle middle part from side to side about a 1/4" and it emits a soft clunk when I reach either the inner CV or outer CV joint. Both act the same. I grasped the CV housing near the diff and I find I can wiggle them a bit. I made sure there is nice clean fluid in the diff and there are no leaks. I've attached a sound file from the right rear knuckle clamp microphone filtered to 300 Hz to eliminate unwanted frequencies. My questions are - does anyone have an idea what this could be? I'm worried that the bearing for the axle may be failing in the differential but can't find how to replace them. Does anyone know about these rear diff units that can shed some light on this issue? Any other ideas welcome. Thanks in advance. RtRear_knuckle.mp3

I know this is an older thread but I thought folks should know that when I broke the wheel speed sensor while changing a rear wheel bearing in my 2011 AWD limited, I had to wait a few days to get the replacement. During that time, all the same lights were on and the "Service AdvanceTrac" message came on every time I started the car. My new part is supposed to be here today or tomorrow, and I hope I don't have to reset the ABS or anything. UPDATE: It was plug and play simple. Once installed (10 minutes) all my warning lights on the dash went back to normal without having to reset anything.

oops! I see my error. I was trying to track down all that has gone on with your brakes to make sure we didn't miss anything. Good luck Dean

Hi Dean, I'm out of ideas here. I remember the backing up and hard stops 'seemed' to firm them up but it really didn't help me either. If all wheels were hot with shiny rotors after riding the brakes, then they appear to be working - just poorly , right? As far as I can tell, your brakes were fine but making noise in December '19 but you said you needed calipers and pads. Did that happen? Did the brakes feel good afterwards? What about February (2020 I assume) when they said it was ABS related and you need a tone ring? I would invest in getting Forscan running and look at all the codes that may be in the ABS system. A Tone Ring would make noise if it came loose (there is a thread on this forum about someone fixing theirs and the noise it makes.) Even though I use Forscan, and no codes were set, I found a road with dirt edges and got my ABS to kick in so that I knew it was working with no codes. I can't say for sure that I managed to get the rear ABS going though. I would manually check the Tone rings by tapping each one lightly with a screwdriver to see if they are tight on the drive shaft. All that said, I don't know how it makes the pedal low unless the HCU is fouled with air and it's not kicking in or stuck in an open position somehow but I'm getting out of my depth quickly here. When my caliper was bad, the brake pedal would go close enough to the floor that my other foot could not fit under the pedal. Needless to say I was driving very defensively. If I think of something else, i'll post. If you find a good local garage, or even a brake shop, maybe they can diagnose it for you. The dealer had their chance. But check forscan for ABS codes. If you fix it, let us know what did it.

Hey Dean, I feel your pain because this should be straightforward - right? I was frustrated on how long it took me to fix it. To answer your question - how to confirm the rear are not engaging - a few thoughts come to mind: 1) Are the rotors shiny/clean? if so, they are likely getting at least some pad contact. 2) Try riding the brakes (foot on the brakes while driving forward) for a quarter mile or so and see if the rear wheels feel as hot as the front. Even better if you have an Infrared contact-less thermometer. My daughter had a sticking brake pad and she came home complaining it was grinding loudly. I got my thermometer and aimed it through the wheel openings at the rotor and caliper. It was 200 deg F while the others were 90 deg F. So this may give you an easy way to tell. Harbor freight had them for cheap when I got mine and I use it for many things. I suspect if they aren't working right the temp will be noticeably cooler than the fronts. (for the record, she never uses her parking brake and the calipers did not adjust causing a lot of play in the piston-to-pad opening, which in turn, caused the pad to tilt and bind) 3) Not sure if you regard the "e brake" as Emergency Brake or Electronic parking brake. The Emergency brake to me is also the manual parking brake using the left most pedal under the dash. If you don't use it, the rear brakes don't adjust properly, if at all. If you have electronic parking brake, there is a button someplace to set it on. or off. All that said, can you drive with the parking brake set easily or do you feel them trying to hold the car still. Mine will let me go forward (because I forget to release it (LOL) but the dash will ding-ding me until I do. The fact is I can move the car fairly easily by stepping on the gas, but it holds the car on a hill in neutral. One of the things I did to try to get my bad caliper to adjust was to go back and forth alternately pushing on the brakes then the parking brake. I must have done it 20 times but mine didn't change - the caliper was simply broken. My 2011 has the manual parking brake. When I applied it, I could see that the cable at the top of the caliper pulled the lever on the caliper toward the front of the car which causes the piston to push against the pads. Even though my caliper was bad, my problem was that the piston should stay close to the pad even after releasing the parking brake. Mine didn't - it went all the way back in. It doesn't sound like this is your problem though, but if you remove the caliper, is it nice and tight to the rotor or does it come off easily? It should be a little stiff if it is adjusting correctly. ** IMPORTANT ** this just occurred to me: When you put your new pads on a while back, how did you get the rear pistons back into the calipers? There is a special procedure to rotate it back (like screwing it in.) BUT: when you do, you have to align the pin on the brake pad to the slot on the piston! Check out MacBWT's video here to see what I mean. If the pin on the pad is not in the slot on the piston, you will lose a lot of braking power in the rear and the parking brake may never adjust it properly. You may want to double check this. Hope this helps. BB56 (Bart)

I wish I knew more about the e brake Dean but I've not seen one. Can someone else jump in here? If the rear brake caliper pistons are traveling because they are not adjusting, they'll gobble up a lot of the fluid from the Master cylinder. One thing I remember is that if I very quickly double pumped the brake pedal, it would be higher the second time - meaning additional fluid from the reservoir was pushed to the brake caliper before it pushed it back after releasing the pedal from the first push. As a troubleshooting step, I would try several times to quickly double pump during a hard stop (remember to check behind you...LOL) to see if the pedal behaves better on the second push. If it seems to grab higher, then something is using up the fluid from the first push. I had to do it several times and if I was real quick the pedal was much better. If you have someone who can push the brake pedal while the car is up on a jack stand, you could look at the rear caliper after removing the tire. See if the first push is moving the caliper piston (the inner pads are pushed by the piston, the outer pads are held in place by the caliper.) Movement is very slight. The whole caliper slides on the two pins that must be greased and move freely as the piston squeezes the inner pad, rotor, and outer pad together. If either the inner pad or the outer pad is sticking, they could be flexing which would consume more fluid. In general, after my neighbor pointed that out, I took the whole caliper off to check its operation and found the piston fully retracted into the caliper. My pads were slightly worn thus giving the piston too much room to travel. So you can pull the caliper, clean the pad mounting surfaces and use brake grease to lube them slightly, make sure the two slide bolts move freely and have plenty of grease under the boots. I'm not a know-it-all, but I am reflecting on why it took me so darn long to figure out a soft brake pedal condition where my pedal was close to the floor but still stopping the car. I think the front brakes were doing all the work. I bled them and found no real difference. I knew the booster was good (no noises and it would pull the brake pedal down when I started the car with my foot on it.) So I bit the bullet and replaced the master cylinder which was a waste of time and money, but thought it was not bled properly again. And finally someone pointed me to inspect the calipers and pads closely. I already checked that the pads were still pretty thick, but went back again as suggested and there it was. To me, brakes should be child's play, but I did not pay attention to details and I suffered time and money for it. If you're still uncertain, maybe try putting new pads in the rear. The thicker material may improve the pedal and then you know something is up in those calipers. Hope this helps because it drove me crazy until I replaced the caliper ($90 at NAPA for Motorcraft replacement.) Good luck! Bart

hey Dean, How does the parking brake feel? Will it hold the car still while in gear? If the parking brake is not adjusted properly, it will not adjust the rear caliper pistons. It could be possible that the rear brakes are not adjusting. When the parking brake is applied, the cable should be very tight at each rear wheel. I've seen where the cable and it's shield get water in them and rust to the point where they can't move. Maybe you want to check for proper operation of the parking brake system.